Will
I expressed my personal opinion on the subject. It is what I totally believe. Trash gives you trash and from a dumpster one gets trash. It has a lot to do with the though process of going to a trash can to begin with.
You may have a different opinion. And you are entitled to that opinion. I won't fault you for that.
We are both after all entitled to our opinions.
And to tell the truth the post is not bothering me. You on the other hand are a different story. What is the problem. What has you so upset with me.
You have an audience so speak up

Personally, Ron, I find your arrogant, condescending attitude offputting. I think your signature sums you up quite well.

Will made a very good point, that just because something goes to the dumpster doesn't necessarily mean it belongs there. You very clearly said that "from a dumpster one gets trash." Will wanted to know if you thought it was possible that sometimes mistakes were made, and indicated that he had some lovely trees that had been saved from just such a mistake. You immediately went on the defensive and intimated that his eye for a good tree was somehow lacking, rather than answer the question that was posed to you.

And don't say you never said exactly those things, I know you didn't use the exact words I put down. There were clear inferences to be taken from your posts. Arguing semantics is as useless as arguing about the definition of the word "is."

Frog

Going back to the saying "One person's trash is another person's treasure," a nursery's trash may be a bonsaiist's treasure. Sometimes they don't want to be bothered nursing unpresentable shrubs/trees back to a presentable condition, so they just chuck them out. Sometimes the plant material that they do throw into the dumpster has a lot of potential of bonsai. A bonsaiist would be willing to nurse them back to health, as their current appearance isn't all that they are focusing upon. Thus, a nursery's trash can be a bonsaiist treasure.

-Audge

No argument from me.
Like you, I gave my opinion and I will have to stand by it. You also have an opinion and you are entitled to it. I just wont attack yours.

Wasn't attacking your opinion, Ron, just your presentation of it. And I stand by my opinion that there is no reason to be rude and belligerent on a public forum.

Frog

Ron,

Opinions can be wrong also, you may like falling behind the "opinion defense" as usual but it doesn't make your opinion right. As I mentioned here, it's a crock.

I agree with Frogboy, there is no reason to be rude and belligerent on a public forum. Now can we get back to the subject at hand?

Will

Will, Frog,

Some of us only come here for the rudeness and belligerence.

Happy New Year's Eve all. Don't do anything Al wouldn't do...

Cheers,

Fish.

A lot of the time suppliers to both bonsai nurserys and to plain nurserys will be one and the same. A company somewhere who grows thousands of trees and then sell them to retailers who sell them on to the public. If you bought a juniper from a nursery and put it in the ground, you will produce a bush. Put a more expensive juniper from a bonsai nursey in the same patch of ground and you get a bush.

Then again, the later bush will probably be a better shape. But in buying the later, you may be able to get three from a plain old nursery for the same price. I think it is a case of quality vs quantity, but mistakes are made. You can still get the quality in landscaping trees, and if you find three of these, you have three times the quantity which are all the same quality as the expensive shrub from a specialist.

You've just gota go looking.

I would like to point out a few things here...
Go to the local nursery's if you like, hell I do it and have a great time there. I even sometimes pick up things to play with. I have however found the following...
Rough (nursery) stock purchased at your local bonsai shop is FAR better suited and picked by the bonsai shop specifically for it's attributes to make the best stock for use with bonsai. You are more likely to find species that are better suited for for bonsai. If you are buying rough stock the prices are not that far off. I'm not sure how bonsai nursery's in other parts of the country/world are, but here in MA each of the nursery's has a rather large section devoted to "Stock Plants". As an example please see This Thread The Juniper seen here was purchased at New England Bonsai Gardens, in a 5 gallon nursery pot for $45 (give or take a couple bucks my memory isn't working this morning). It has over a 2" trunk at the base and had so many options of where to go with it Kenji Miyata said we could do anything we wanted with it. The Juniper shown HERE was purchased at Bonsai West for the nominal fee of $19.95 and again had plenty of options to work with and a 1" trunk. Due to personal circumstances I was unable to finish the initial styling before the contest deadline but you will see the results in the spring when I can complete the work. Also just before the winter I purchased another Juniper from Bonsai West that they had for only $14.99 that had been a stock plant sitting in the back since the late 80's. Plenty of potential here as well.

And my final thought.. If you don't support your local bonsai nursery's in buying their lower-priced stock even to play around with...
THEY WILL NOT BE THERE FOR YOU IN THE FUTURE!
They depend on us as customers just as we depend on them for our needs.

Thank you for listening to my .02
Adam

I totally agree with Will. To prove his point here are some of my finds.

1. Large, japanese forest pot. Free, in the dumpster.

2. Large, japanese rectangle pot. Free, in the dumpster.

3. Large boxwood. Had rust from overhead shade system on the leaves making them a bronze color, hadn't sold due to color for 2 or 3 years. Nursery man that I took the time to make friends with gave it to me for free. Just wanted to see pictures of what I have done with it.

So be nice and don't be afraid to dumpster dive, never know what you'll find.

Newt

Attached Images

	larch forest 5-16-04.jpg (31.6 KB, 170 views)
	free pot, larch.jpg (58.1 KB, 124 views)
	03.jpg (56.9 KB, 152 views)
	free boxwood styled 04.jpg (56.5 KB, 182 views)