A different view of soil

gerryg

I'm fairly new to Bonsai but have been and avid gardener for may years including aquatic gardens.

If I transfer concepts from other plant situations, I wonder if the "secret" to Bonsai soil reduces to two simple concepts. Both involve roots.

- a soil must match the grower's watering habbits. Specifically not dry out too much for the bonsai in question.

- The focus on soil being too wet is fairly unimportant! What really matters is can roots obtain a necessary oxygen level and not be exposed to toxic gas released due to decay of organic materials.

I have found oxygen at roots is the most critical factor when growing aquatic plants indoors over the winter. Without an air stone, many suffer root rot and die. Is this concept transferable to bonsai? If so, too wet is not a major concern, oxygen deprivation is!

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RonMartin(deceased)

Will_Heath

Ron's is right on here. You can read more from him on bonsai soil here.


Will

TreeBay

You can grow a lot of different plants in water using hydroponic techniques - many kinds of plants that would not ordinarily survive with their roots immersed in water. Hydroponics involves bubbling oxygenated, nutrient-rich solutions around the roots of the plants. That oxygen helps prevent anaerobic bacteria from getting hold and causing root rot.

I am not sure that one could not grow trees using hydroponic techniques. I would be somewhat surprised if one could not!

http://howtohydroponics.com/hydroponic_planter.html

[UPDATE] As I was about to close this post I decided to search on Hydroponics and Trees. I was surprised to find this article by our own Jerry Meislik:

http://www.bonsaihunk.8m.com/info/Hydroponics.html

So, hydroponics seems to be an entirely viable way of growing certain trees, why not consider its use for bonsai?

Regards,

Matt

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gerryg

I realize this is a different concept than traditionaly expressed. It was actually triggered by a discussion with my local bonsai master who also has interest is Japanese water gardens. Poorly oxygenated water is "dead" to aquatic plants of interest.

This does not mean the net results are not the same, water logged soil can not bring oxygen too a plant's roots. Hydroponics certianly has demonstrated than many teresterial plants can be grown in very different conditions than once assumed. However, plants so grown have the same requirements as ones grown in soil.

I'm merely tossing a different concept regarding the needed mechanisms, gas exchange, oxygen and the like. To me, what a life form needs to survive is interesting, not just methods proven to work. If we address a plant's fundamental requirements, it should not matter how they are provided.

RonMartin(deceased)

TreeBay

Hi Ron,

I am curious if you followed the link? The ficus on the far right in the photo grew with its root system underwater. Jerry says it has 5x as much foliage of typical.

http://www.bonsaihunk.8m.com/info/Hydroponics.html

Regards,

Matt

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gerryg

Thanks for the link Matt

I am new to bonsai and somewhat confused by the many soil discussions. Without my own "tradition", I am atempting to understand the actual needs of plants used for bonsai. (aware there are many differering plants) Tossing hydroponics at it is an interesting exteme case. Much like a human in a space station, the life form only gets what is supplied by intent.

gerry

Paul Phillis

A thing about hydroponics is that it consumes more energy to maintain a tree than it costs for a tree in a pot.
Things like pumps for circulation, nutrients and management of them, aerators plumbing etc. I understand that a lot of people grow their trees underlights already, but hydroponics adds and extra dimension to the costs.

And trees look better in ceramic pots, rather than in gutters.

Bonsai potting mixes (all potting mixes) are a trade off in water holding capacity and air filled porosity. These two factors are simply governed by pot depth and particle size. The attraction of water to particles (particularly small voids or spaces) determines when a pore space or void will drain. A small pore requires greater suction than a large pore. The deeper the pot the greater the "suction" on the water film that surrounds the soil particles and hence the smaller the soil pores that will drain. The larger the particles, the larger the pore spaces and the less suction required for draining. So a soil/mix with fine particles will have very little air filled porosity in a shallow pot, becoming water logged. But will have adequate airfilled porosity in a very tall pot. A mix of large particles will have adequate airfilled porosity in a shallow pot but insufficient water in a very tall pot.


Paul