bonsaiTALK Home Page  

Go Back   bonsaiTALK Community > Clubs in Action > REC.ARTS.BONSAI
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read
Forum Gallery Weather Journals Links Webring Wiki NEW:Shop
Articles Opinion T.O.D. NEW:Radio Contests Humor NEW: Auctions! Donate


Re: Wiring...how damp is my soil?

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
bonsaiTALK Hint: Did you know you can double click any bonsai term on this page for its definition?
Old 7-Sep-2004   #1
Andrew G
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Wiring...how damp is my soil?

Hi there
Going out on a limb here, different to other replies.
Ok, probably stating obvious here, especially to people who probably know
more about bonsai than I do, but moisture content in soil is no indication
of moisutre content in plant. I agree with the replies that a plant that has
moist soil may let the branches bend easier to avoid snapping, due to the
higher moisture content in plant.
My guess is this dry soil v's dryish during wiring is cos during wiring the
plant is going to get a bit of movement. Moist soil may allow the whole root
structure to move, possibly uplifting some roots. On the other hand if the
soil is completely dry then possibly the opposite will happen. You may
fracture or even snap off roots as it doesn't allow movement, and possibly
fracture the trunk.
This is only my guess, but I take it that it refers to root damage as
really, you could have moist soil from a recent water, yet previous to that
it was dry and plant was almost wilted. Yes the soil is moist, but doesn't
mean the plant has high moisture content for wiring, as the plant is yet to
take it up fully. Branches may snap. On the other hand yes the soil may
become dry, maybe after 1 warm day, but the plant has a high moisture
content. It may be fine to water.
Also the soil could be just freshly watered, as compared to dryish. Freshly
watered I would think would be better IF you go with the theory that the
branches will bend better, but bad idea for movement of root ball in soil.
Really if it isn't so much what I am talking about, and more to do with
higher moisture in the plant then books should make references to plant
condition and "watering well in the few days before wiring" rather than soil
moisture content.
I assume it isn't much discussed as it doesn't really matter too much. IMO I
would just make sure plant isn't stressed, soil is anything but "saturated"
so dry to dryish would be ok, and if anything, maybe spray branches with
water from mist bottle to help with bending.
Only thing I've ever read that perhaps isn't too obvious until you hear/read
or experience it, is to not wire a recently rootpruned plant as movement of
it in the soil may damage new root shoots
Cheers
Andrew
--
Mid North Coast
New South Wales
Australia


"Pat Patterson" <dezertrats@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040906045134.03671.00000240@mb-m04.aol.com...
> G'day all...
>
> I guess the question should be "how damp should my soil be?".
>
> However, to the point...traditional wisdom tells us that our soil should

be
> relatively "dry" when wiring. For example, Tom Zane says in his Syllabus

(4th
> ed., 2001) that the soil "...should be relatively dry..."; and, Deborah
> Koreshoff says the soil should be "dryish" (to the point that it is due

for
> watering), not turgid. I've heard the same thing several times in

lectures,
> classes and workshops as recently as 5 years back.
>
> Now, I have recently been told that this thinking is changing...that there
> should be more moisture than previously thought, in the soil.
>
> I have researched at least 15 books, plus other sources, and curiously,

the
> subject is seldom discussed.
>
> Is the traditional wisdom changing? Is there, in fact, significant

evidence
> that indicates more moisture?
>
> Would like to hear your thoughts.
>
> Have a good day...
>
> Pat
>
>
> Dez of the Arizona High Dezert, at 4550', Oracle, AZ,
> 2000' above Tucson Sunset Zone 10 USDA Zone 8
> aka: Pat Patterson 'riding off in all directions'
>



  Reply With Quote
Old Sponsor Message Re: Wiring...how damp is my soil?
Advertisement
Forum Sponsor
Old 9-Sep-2004   #2
Nina Shishkoff
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Wiring...how damp is my soil?

Michael said:

>The logic works for me, but experience tells me otherwise. I have

bent
>some extremely old branches with tight growth rings. The trees that
>were allowed to dry out before the stylings were significantly easier

to
>bend. I attribute this to the amazing strength of the water swollen
>inner bark.


The first step is to reason something out, as I did in my post, but
the second step is to test the hypothesis. There are two hypotheses I
can come up with: one, that increased tension in the water columns of
the xylem with drying-out makes the branch more flexible, or two, that
turgor of the inner bark has some effect on the breakability of the
bark (I can't think of any way that the inner bark could influence the
wood, sorry!).

I like the former hypothesis. To test it, I'd use tomato plants.
Tomatos transport water to the leaves by two different methods:
positive pressure, pushing water up the stem by an osmotic pump or:
negative pressure, using transpiration to PULL water up the stem. If
the pressure of water in the xylem has an effect of flexibility, then
I'd expect the tomatos using the ionic pump to snap easily, and the
tomatoes using transpiration to snap. I have tools to measure soil
water potential and leaf water potential; I have tools that can
measure the pressure I'm putting on stems. The only problem I can see
is that I'd be exposing the plants to different levels of humidity,
and that would be a complicating factor.

However, if I got promising results with the tomato, I could try:
sugar maple saplings!!!! In spring, before leaves emerge, maples use
an osmotic pump to move water up the stem ("the sap is running").
After leaves emerge, maples use a transpiration pump.

Now you've got me all excited! Except today I am grinding up soybean
roots to use the tissue for PCR analysis!


Nina. Yes. I dream about experiments.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Soils: Any Opinions? Ron Martin Soils, Fertilizer & Repotting 37 3-Jun-2008 01:33 AM
Re: White "mold" or fungus?? on soil and base of t Tony Pests & Disease 8 31-Dec-2006 09:32 AM
What Soil Do You Use ? Camay123 Soils, Fertilizer & Repotting 4 1-Aug-2004 02:04 PM
What Soil Do You Grow Out In? BonsaiBen Soils, Fertilizer & Repotting 11 26-May-2004 04:29 AM
What's the big fuss about soil ingredients? TreeBay bonsaiTALK FAQ 0 31-Oct-2001 02:37 PM


All times are GMT -3. The time now is 07:48 PM.


Powered by vBulletin v3.6.5
Copyright ©2000-2007, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC8