Re: [IBC] Unattended Pre-Bonsai -- possible?

Billy M. Rhodes

I would agree with Brian's response to this question. However, if
there is a time of year with consistent rain it still might work.
Or if planted in early winter when the trees are dormant and given a
good snowfall, the melting snow might provide the needed moisture to get the
plants started.
Without irrigation you would be like the average farmer. There will
be good years and bad years. If you only plant a few fairly common,
inexpensive trees, you might take a chance.

But, realize your are taking a chance.


In a message dated 6/24/2004 12:45:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
not4smurf@YAHOO.COM writes:

> > My family owns undeveloped property outside of Visalia, California. I
> asked Mom (the owner)
> >if I could put some pre-bonsia in the ground. She thinks that the trees
> would die due to lack
> >of attention ( it's 6 hours away).
> > It's hot in the summer and may get some snow in winter. My plan to put
> hardy local types up
> >there (oak, pepper, juniper, pine, sequoia, etc) that have nice rootballs
> in well prepared
> >beds. I could visit 2-4 times a year. Certainly, I need to do much more
> research ...
> >
> >What does the group thinks my chances of success might be?
>
> Bob,
> This is not specifically a bonsai response, but plants in general. I
> think you have great chance of success except for 1 thing. You will need to
> stay with the plants for the first 4 - 6 weeks to keep the water up to them
> while they get settled in...
>
> Brian
>


Billy on the Florida Space Coast
BSF Annual Convention July 1 - 4, 2005 Radisson Hotel, Cape Canaveral,
Florida
Workshops with Jerry Meislek of Whitefish, Montana and Chase Rosade of New
Hope, PA.

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Dad

Your chances are 0. Unless you can water regularly for the first few weeks,
your seedlings won't stand a chance to survive. Even if you do get someone
to provide early watering, the CA climate will surely do them in.
Marty

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Campbell" <bobcampbell@SPAMBLOCKED.COM>
To: <BONSAI@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2004 11:21 PM
Subject: [IBC] Unattended Pre-Bonsai -- possible?


> Hi:
>
> My family owns undeveloped property outside of Visalia, California. I
asked Mom (the owner)
> if I could put some pre-bonsia in the ground. She thinks that the trees
would die due to lack
> of attention ( it's 6 hours away).
> It's hot in the summer and may get some snow in winter. My plan to put
hardy local types up
> there (oak, pepper, juniper, pine, sequoia, etc) that have nice rootballs
in well prepared
> beds. I could visit 2-4 times a year. Certainly, I need to do much more
research ...
>
> What does the group thinks my chances of success might be?
>
> Thank You
> bob campbell
> zone 7 Fremont CA
>
> ps: I read the group via usenet if that matters, the email address is
valid and heavily
> filtered.
>
>
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>
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****
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Jim Lewis

> Your chances are 0. Unless you can water regularly for the
first few weeks,
> your seedlings won't stand a chance to survive. Even if you do
get someone
> to provide early watering, the CA climate will surely do them
in.
> Marty
>

Well, not quite zero. Like Billy said, if you plant trees native
to that area in EARLY spring, the snowmelt and spring rains MIGHT
be enough.

Also, if you plant large enough pre-bonsai -- 5 gallon pots or
more, dig large, SHALLOW holes 3X diameter of 5-gal (or whatever)
pot and no deeper than pot depth and fill with Good Topsoil and
sphagnum moss (50/50) you may get better survival. Bigger plants
mean a larger loss, though.

It will be iffy. Is there a friendly neighbor?

Jim Lewis - jklewis@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - Only where
people have learned to appreciate and cherish the landscape and
its living cover will they treat it with the care and respect it
should have - Paul Bigelow Sears.

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Richard Patefield

A hefty layer of mulch may also help. It won't retain moisture that
isn't there in the first place however.

I guess you aint going to know till you try it.

Richard


On Thu, 24 Jun 2004 08:20:11 -0400, you wrote:

>> Your chances are 0. Unless you can water regularly for the
>first few weeks,
>> your seedlings won't stand a chance to survive. Even if you do
>get someone
>> to provide early watering, the CA climate will surely do them
>in.
>> Marty
>>
>
>Well, not quite zero. Like Billy said, if you plant trees native
>to that area in EARLY spring, the snowmelt and spring rains MIGHT
>be enough.
>
>Also, if you plant large enough pre-bonsai -- 5 gallon pots or
>more, dig large, SHALLOW holes 3X diameter of 5-gal (or whatever)
>pot and no deeper than pot depth and fill with Good Topsoil and
>sphagnum moss (50/50) you may get better survival. Bigger plants
>mean a larger loss, though.
>
>It will be iffy. Is there a friendly neighbor?
>
>Jim Lewis - jklewis@nettally.com - Tallahassee, FL - Only where
>people have learned to appreciate and cherish the landscape and
>its living cover will they treat it with the care and respect it
>should have - Paul Bigelow Sears.
>
>************************************************** ******************************
> ++++Sponsored, in part, by John Quinn++++
>************************************************** ******************************
>>>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
> +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

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************************************************** ******************************
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Evergreen Gardenworks

At 03:21 AM 6/24/04 +0000, Robert Campbell wrote:
>Hi:
>
> My family owns undeveloped property outside of Visalia, California. I
> asked Mom (the owner)
>if I could put some pre-bonsia in the ground. She thinks that the trees
>would die due to lack
>of attention ( it's 6 hours away).
> It's hot in the summer and may get some snow in winter. My plan to put
> hardy local types up
>there (oak, pepper, juniper, pine, sequoia, etc) that have nice rootballs
>in well prepared
>beds. I could visit 2-4 times a year. Certainly, I need to do much more
>research ...
>
>What does the group thinks my chances of success might be?

Bob

Put me in the near zero chance group. If you don't have any way to actively
irrigate these plants on a regular basis, they will almost certainly die.
Even native plants have strategies for survival that you probably won't be
able to duplicate. Native plants in our arid climate have very narrow
environmental ranges and even hundreds of them die for every one that succeeds.

It truly remarkable that anything survives around here in the summer. We
are talking about daytime summer temperatures that are rarely below 80 and
can go as high as 115, with low humidity, endless sun, and the kicker is
that there is usually NO measureable rainfall from June (and sometimes even
March!) until November. Soil can be bone dry to 20 feet down by late summer.

I'm not real familiar with Visalia, but I don't think they get snow there,
at least not more a spot or two of wet snow that is gone within hours. With
irrigation, and someone around to make sure it is working, you could of
course grow a lot plants that could tolerate that level of sunlight.


Brent in Northern California
Evergreen Gardenworks USDA Zone 8 Sunset Zone 14
mailto:bonsai@pacific.net
http://www.EvergreenGardenworks.com

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************************************************** ******************************
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+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

Shelly Hurd

I'm way closer to Visalia than any of the responders, and I agree with Brent. ZERO. No one even mentioned the "critters" and believe me, if it's green, even for a little while, the deer --will-- make it disappear. I had some land up by Don Pedro, and e
ven with drip irrigation, only one tree in five survived more than one year, and those were from 15 gallon pots.

Rotsa-Ruck.
Shelly Hurd Central CA - Sunset Zone 8-USDA Zone 9
shelly@hurdfam.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Evergreen Gardenworks
To: BONSAI@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2004 4:29 AM
Subject: Re: [IBC] Unattended Pre-Bonsai -- possible?


At 03:21 AM 6/24/04 +0000, Robert Campbell wrote:
>Hi:
>
> My family owns undeveloped property outside of Visalia, California. I
> asked Mom (the owner)
>if I could put some pre-bonsia in the ground. She thinks that the trees
>would die due to lack
>of attention ( it's 6 hours away).
> It's hot in the summer and may get some snow in winter. My plan to put
> hardy local types up
>there (oak, pepper, juniper, pine, sequoia, etc) that have nice rootballs
>in well prepared
>beds. I could visit 2-4 times a year. Certainly, I need to do much more
>research ...
>
>What does the group thinks my chances of success might be?

Bob

Put me in the near zero chance group. If you don't have any way to actively
irrigate these plants on a regular basis, they will almost certainly die.
Even native plants have strategies for survival that you probably won't be
able to duplicate. Native plants in our arid climate have very narrow
environmental ranges and even hundreds of them die for every one that succeeds.

It truly remarkable that anything survives around here in the summer. We
are talking about daytime summer temperatures that are rarely below 80 and
can go as high as 115, with low humidity, endless sun, and the kicker is
that there is usually NO measureable rainfall from June (and sometimes even
March!) until November. Soil can be bone dry to 20 feet down by late summer.

I'm not real familiar with Visalia, but I don't think they get snow there,
at least not more a spot or two of wet snow that is gone within hours. With
irrigation, and someone around to make sure it is working, you could of
course grow a lot plants that could tolerate that level of sunlight.


Brent in Northern California
Evergreen Gardenworks USDA Zone 8 Sunset Zone 14
mailto:bonsai@pacific.net
http://www.EvergreenGardenworks.com

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++++Sponsored, in part, by John Quinn++++
************************************************** ******************************
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+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

Kitsune Miko

All is not lost. Perhaps there are collectables on
Granny's land.

Growing in the ground has advantages and
disadvantages. The major disadvantage is having the
feeder roots way down there. I have a growing ground
that has had top pruning and side root pruning with a
sharp shovel. I went to dig some up and found that
the trees where I thought I had removed the tap root
had developed new taps that may reach China. This is
in wet soil.

I now have the project of promoting roots higher up
before removal from ground to pots. We are digging
down on one side of the tree, scratching bark,
applying rooting hormones and filling with more porous
soils. I did this with an oak donated by the
squirrels and it worked quite well.

Kitsune Miko

=====
"I was born with a birth defect-- no herd instinct."
Brenda Ueland

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++++Sponsored, in part, by John Quinn++++
************************************************** ******************************
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