[IBC] The Need to Feed (Was Re: [IBC] Shimpaku Juniper)

Michael Persiano

Iris writes:


Is anyone familiar with the shimpakus that are being marketed by Iseli? I
bought one last June. It was small and compact to begin with. I put it in the
ground, but it has hardly grown at all (other plants in the vicinity have grown
normally). Superficially, it looks like a dwarf compared to my other Shimpaku.
I am very puzzled by the picture of Shimpaku in the Illustrated Encyclopedia
of Conifers. Is that Shimpaku?

Iris:

The Shimpaku is a reasonably show growing specimen. If you aggressively feed the tree, you can expect to see substantial development after one year.

BTW: Aggressive feeding WILL NOT produce abnormally large foliar features. Excessive watering WILL product abnormally large foliar features.

Cordially,

Michael Persiano
http://members.aol.com/iasnob

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Evergreen Gardenworks++++
************************************************** ******************************
>>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

Advertisement

IrisCohen@AOL.COM

In a message dated 8/26/04 9:09:38 AM, IASNOB writes:
> The Shimpaku is a reasonably show growing specimen. * If you aggressively
> feed the tree, you can expect to see substantial development after one year.
>
I feed everybody as aggressively as possible, except for a few full-grown
specimens. After comparing pictures and descriptions, I suspect my little one is
'Kishu Shimpaku,' which is fine with me.
Iris

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Evergreen Gardenworks++++
************************************************** ******************************
>>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

Kitsune Miko

Interesting quandry: When we are developing trees, we
wnat to get there quickly, but when we get there we
want the trees to go into a growth holding pattern.

I have a Kinsville Box that just sits there. It has
sat there now for about 10-15 years in a 10 gallon
can, super fed underfed, no difference. If its
growing at all, its got me fooled. Some day perhaps,
I will bite the bullet and admit that as a bonsai,
this one will be best at 3 inches.

Kitsune Miko

OT Haiku

Roused from summer lethargy
By the frosted edges
Of a late summer’s day

Copyright 8-26-04 by the
Poetess Kitsune Miko

--- IrisCohen@AOL.COM wrote:

> In a message dated 8/26/04 9:09:38 AM, IASNOB
> writes:
> > The Shimpaku is a reasonably show growing
> specimen. If you aggressively
> > feed the tree, you can expect to see substantial
> development after one year.
> >
> I feed everybody as aggressively as possible, except
> for a few full-grown
> specimens. After comparing pictures and
> descriptions, I suspect my little one is
> 'Kishu Shimpaku,' which is fine with me.
> Iris
>
>
************************************************** ******************************
> ++++Sponsored, in part, by Evergreen
> Gardenworks++++
>
************************************************** ******************************
> >>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ:
> http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
> +++++ Questions? Help? e-mail
> BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++
>


=====
****
"Expectations are resentments under construction."

Anne Lamott

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Evergreen Gardenworks++++
************************************************** ******************************
>>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

Michael Persiano

Kitsune writes:

Interesting quandry: When we are developing trees, we
wnat to get there quickly, but when we get there we
want the trees to go into a growth holding pattern.

I have a Kinsville Box that just sits there. It has
sat there now for about 10-15 years in a 10 gallon
can, super fed underfed, no difference. If its
growing at all, its got me fooled. Some day perhaps,
I will bite the bullet and admit that as a bonsai,
this one will be best at 3 inches.

Kitsune:

I am about the publish an article in Bonsai Europe on the styling of a 50 year old Kingsville. The tree went through a drastic styling (the first) in the spring of 2004. The combination of fast-draining soil and Superfeeding (my method) has resulted in
remarkable growth--even for this species that is reputed to grow at 1/8-1/4 inch per year.

We do have the ability to style our trees and produce targeted growth. I will soon place a few photographs on my site. I will point those of you to the site who have interest in this species in the near future.

Kingsville, when motivated, will grow like weeds.

Cordially,

Michael Persiano
members.aol.com/iasnob

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Evergreen Gardenworks++++
************************************************** ******************************
>>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

Craig Cowing

Michael Persiano wrote:

> Kitsune writes:
>
> <snip>
>
> I have a Kinsville Box that just sits there. It has
> sat there now for about 10-15 years in a 10 gallon
> can, super fed underfed, no difference.

<snip>

>
> Kitsune:
>
> I am about the publish an article in Bonsai Europe on the styling of a 50 year old Kingsville. The tree went through a drastic styling (the first) in the spring of 2004. The combination of fast-draining soil and Superfeeding (my method) has resulted i
n remarkable growth--even for this species that is reputed to grow at 1/8-1/4 inch per year.
>
> <snip>
> Kingsville, when motivated, will grow like weeds.
>
> Cordially,
>
> Michael Persiano
> members.aol.com/iasnob

I have had the same experience with Kingsville. I have three of them and now a pile of cuttings. Last year I bought two 2 gallon specimens that had been grown outdoors in Maryland. The nursery guy started them himself from cuttings and knew exactly how o
ld they are--now 42 years--the same age as Anita! (am I allowed to reveal that info?)
Anyway, I have been fertilizing these along with my other trees and have had tremendous growth and development of pads. I cut them down this spring and potted them in pots, and one will be ready for display at our wedding in October. With repeated manicu
ring I have found that it is possible to develop well-defined pads in a couple of years. One
caveat with fertilizing, however, is that a Kingsville will sometimes respond with larger growth, so if that happens it might be necessary to back off on fertilizer.

I don't know where the 1/8" to 1/4" growth a year thing came from, Michael, but I've gotten more growth than that. It is a truly satisfying cultivar to work with, especially in a climate such as mine where they will not winter safely outdoors. I keep mi
ne outside until around early December, then bring them in and keep them under fluorescent
lights--very close to the lights. This helps in quicker development because you extend the growing season.

Craig Cowing
NY
zone 5b/6a Sunset 37

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Evergreen Gardenworks++++
************************************************** ******************************
>>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

Michael Persiano

In a message dated 8/29/2004 1:15:34 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ccowing@frontiernet.net writes:
One
caveat with fertilizing, however, is that a Kingsville will sometimes respond
with larger growth, so if that happens it might be necessary to back off on
fertilizer.

I don't know where the 1/8" to 1/4" growth a year thing came from, Michael,
but I've gotten more growth than that. It is a truly satisfying cultivar to
work with, especially in a climate such as mine where they will not winter
safely outdoors. I keep mine outside until around early December, then bring them
in and keep them under fluorescent
lights--very close to the lights. This helps in quicker development because
you extend the growing season.
Craig:

My preference is to winter Kingsville in a cold environment at around
35-degrees Fahrenheit. As you know, they do quite well in your neck of the woods as
fielded material for bonsai.

On another note, I would suggest that the larger leaves on the Kingsville are
the result of a little too much water and not the result of fertilizing. I
will post the styled tree for Bonsai Europe with a close up of the foliage--the
result of intensive feedings throughout the 2004 growing season.

Cordially,

Michael Persiano
members.aol.com/iasnob

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Evergreen Gardenworks++++
************************************************** ******************************
>>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++

Craig Cowing

IASNOB@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 8/29/2004 1:15:34 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> ccowing@frontiernet.net writes:
>
> One
> caveat with fertilizing, however, is that a Kingsville will
> sometimes respond with larger growth, so if that happens it
> might be necessary to back off on fertilizer.
>
> I don't know where the 1/8" to 1/4" growth a year thing came
> from, Michael, but I've gotten more growth than that. It is
> a truly satisfying cultivar to work with, especially in a
> climate such as mine where they will not winter safely
> outdoors. I keep mine outside until around early December,
> then bring them in and keep them under fluorescent
> lights--very close to the lights. This helps in quicker
> development because you extend the growing season.
>
> Craig: >My preference is to winter Kingsville in a cold environment at
> around 35-degrees Fahrenheit. As you know, they do quite well in your
> neck of the woods as fielded material for bonsai.
>
> Michael:
>
> I guess you're not familiar with my area. Despite the fact that I'm
> only 1.5 hours away from downtown Manhattan, it gets considerably
> colder here. We're at a much higher elevation than NYC. Last winter
> we had several mornings below zero, a couple of times at -10. Even in
> a protected environment I am quite sure a Kingsville would not survive
> a winter outdoors here. Even my Ilex crenata didn't make it and it
> was pretty well protected. I also lost a few small Chinese Elms and
> another died back to the base, and all were protected. People here
> tell me that's the coldest it gets here, but I don't want to take any
> chances. I find my Kingsvilles do quite well indoors after a month or
> more of dormancy outside. The other problem is that I don't have an
> area in the house or elsewhere that is dry and stays around 35F.
> >On another note, I would suggest that the larger leaves on the
> Kingsville are the result of a little too much water and not the
> result of fertilizing. I will post the styled tree for Bonsai Europe
> with a close up of the foliage--the result of intensive feedings
> throughout the 2004 growing season. Cordially, Michael
> Persianomembers.aol.com/iasnob
>
> That's a possibility I haven't thought about. The trees are in full
> shade and I water pretty much every day. Would it be ok to cut back
> on watering some? It isn't a serious problem--I just get a flush of
> growth like that occasionally. I cut it all off and no harm is
> done. This happens, btw, on two out of three of my trees. The third
> I've had longer and it doesn't produce these leaves.
>
> I'll be looking forward to the pictures. When is the magazine going
> to be available? I don't subscribe but I'd love to get a copy.
>
> Craig Cowing
> NY
> Zone 5b/6a Sunset 37

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Evergreen Gardenworks++++
************************************************** ******************************
>>-->> The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ <<--<<
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail BONSAI-REQUEST@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM +++++