[IBC] cryptomeria blight

Les linfoot

can anybody advise me re my ailing cryptomeria (Jindai sugi). Various
branches turning reddish brown, seems to have stopped taking up water
from the soil. I have moved it to a shady spot and stopped watering it.
Still misting it, though, and I have sprayed it with a sulphur based
fungicide on the suspicion that this is the infamous cryptomeria blight
I have read about. Anything else I need to be doing?

Thanx in advance for any suggestions you may offer.

Les Linfoot
New Westminster, BC, Canada
Zone 8

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Nina Shishkoff

Les said:
can anybody advise me re my ailing cryptomeria (Jindai sugi). Various
branches turning reddish brown, seems to have stopped taking up water
from the soil. I have moved it to a shady spot and stopped watering
it.
Still misting it, though, and I have sprayed it with a sulphur based
fungicide on the suspicion that this is the infamous cryptomeria
blight
I have read about.

I say:

Les, is this plant outdoors? I only ask because you say you are
misting it, and I can't imagine why anyone would mist an outdoor tree.
At any rate, if you *do* have cryptomeria blight, misting is the
worst possible idea- the disease spreads in water droplets, and
everyone universally advises good air circulation to control this
problem.

Look at the diseased foliage and twigs for little embedded black
spots; that's the key sign of the disease.

If it's clear that the tree has blight, sulfur fungicide is OK, but
I'd stop misting, and prune the tree to remove diseased foliage
(sterilize the tool between cuts with 70% alcohol or 10% bleach, and
certainly sterilize before using on any other conifer!). If weather
is rainy, I'd provide shelter during storms to keep the needles dry.

Obviously, if the plant is indoors, being indoors is the problem, not
blight. Cryptomeria will not survive indoors unless you have a good
set-up for it.

Nina Shishkoff

Marty

In September, remove it from the pot and check the roots. At least that way
, you could eliminate one possibility.
Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: "Les linfoot" <leslinfoot@SHAW.CA>
To: <BONSAI@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 4:21 AM
Subject: [IBC] cryptomeria blight


> can anybody advise me re my ailing cryptomeria (Jindai sugi). Various
> branches turning reddish brown, seems to have stopped taking up water
> from the soil. I have moved it to a shady spot and stopped watering it.
> Still misting it, though, and I have sprayed it with a sulphur based
> fungicide on the suspicion that this is the infamous cryptomeria blight
> I have read about. Anything else I need to be doing?
>
> Thanx in advance for any suggestions you may offer.
>
> Les Linfoot
> New Westminster, BC, Canada
> Zone 8
>
>
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Les linfoot

Sorry to be so long getting back to the group on this. I put the
question up without considering that I would be unable to get to a
computer for the next day and a half. I'm going to have to invoke the
"I'm-still-kind-of-new-at-this" clause in my defence.

Marty; I am beginning to wonder if you are not right on the money. After
reading Nina's response (see reply below) I wonder if I might, as you
suspect, really be dealing with a root problem.

Nina; I really appreciate someone with your level of expertise taking
the time to advise me. In answer to your questions..
Yes, the tree is outdoors. I am misting an outdoor tree because
Tomlinson (The Complete Book of Bonsai, page 116) says, "Water
generously once a day and mist-spray foliage daily during the summer
months." Adams (Bonsai Design: Deciduous and Coniferous Trees, page 47,
in the chapter devoted to junipers and cryptomeria) says, "Central to
the robust health of Junipers, is daily foliar misting, which supplies
the 'cloud cover' so appreciated by this species. this also applies to
Cryptomeria." Lewis (Bonsai: A Care Manual, page 87) says, "Cryptomeria
inhabit the lower slopes of mountains where they are shrouded in mist in
the morning and exposed to the sun for the rest of the day. Provided you
can ensure that the pot will not dry out through evaporation, and you
can spray the foliage two or three times a day, your cryptomeria will do
well in full sun."

Air circulation is pretty good, even in the semi-shaded spot I have move
the tree to.

Black spots? This is new and useful info. A search with a magnifying
lens reveals no little black spots. Perhaps this is not blight, after
all.

The tree is under cover so even if it did rain here (weather has been
unusually warm and dry) it would not get wet.

While checking the Colin Lewis reference, I noticed a paragraph about
how spider mites love cryptomeria, but I can't see them. Should I spray
with an insecticide just in case?

The browning of the needles is scattered over the whole tree. It does
not begin at the ends of the branches and work its way in the way it did
with our blighted garden pyracanthas earlier this year.

I have been cutting back where I can, disinfecting tools with bleach as
I go.

Thanks again for your help. Any new ideas gratefully recieved.

Les Linfoot
New Westminster, BC, Canada
Zone 8

Nina Shishkoff

Les linfoot <leslinfoot@shaw.ca> wrote in message news:<leslinfoot-B434E3.20593714082004@shawnews.vw.shawcable.net>...
> I am misting an outdoor tree because
> Tomlinson (The Complete Book of Bonsai, page 116) says, "Water
> generously once a day and mist-spray foliage daily during the summer
> months." Adams (Bonsai Design: Deciduous and Coniferous Trees, page 47,
> in the chapter devoted to junipers and cryptomeria) says, "Central to
> the robust health of Junipers, is daily foliar misting, which supplies
> the 'cloud cover' so appreciated by this species. this also applies to
> Cryptomeria." Lewis (Bonsai: A Care Manual, page 87) says, "Cryptomeria
> inhabit the lower slopes of mountains where they are shrouded in mist in
> the morning and exposed to the sun for the rest of the day. Provided you
> can ensure that the pot will not dry out through evaporation, and you
> can spray the foliage two or three times a day, your cryptomeria will do
> well in full sun."

Well, honestly, that all sounds like nonsense to me. I have never
misted a juniper in my life. If you live in a dry climate, no amount
of misting is going to create a "cloud cover". And if you live in a
humid place, misting isn't going to add appreciable humidity.
Cryptomerias are trees of the lower canopy of forests, so the best way
to give them the conditions they require is to give them some shade.
Treat them as you would a Japanese maple.

However, of all tree used in bonsai, cryptomeria can have the densest
foliage, so misting (or keeping it in the shade, or sheltering it from
wind) can increase the number of hours of leaf moisture inside the
foliage pads. As a plant pathologist, I see this as only a bad thing;
it fosters fungi. I always trim my trees to avoid pockets of thick
foliage.

On this list, the most commonly reported problem of cryptomeria is
inner browning of the foliage, which is generally attributed to lack
of sunlight penetrating through all that thick foliage. The solution
is to thin the foliage. Your problem is not inner browning, but,
according to your description, a browning of whole branches. You
might want to go to a nursery with cryptomerias and observe a whole
bunch of them to make sure this isn't natural-- I have a cultivar of
Chamaecyparis thyoides ('Little Jamie') that normally loses its lower
branches, so I don't even worry about it any more. You might, as
Marty suggested, have a root problem. I'm fearless when it comes to
roots (I did my PhD on root anatomy!), so if I were you, I'd water the
tree like normal, then I'd carefully pull the tree out of the pot and
poke around. I'd be worried about pockets of soil that for some
reason or other do not get wet; this is a real problem of trees grown
in soil and transplanted to pots later; often a core of clay resists
wetting, and roots within that core die. Overwatering can also be a
problem, but rarely in outdoor bonsai in good soil. If your soil is
heavy, and smells rank and "anaerobic", it may be water-logged. Look
for obviously dead roots. If you know what healthy roots look like,
look for roots that are darker or slimier. Healthy juniper roots are
brown and flexible, with tips that are plump and reddish. If you see
dead roots, remove them. If the problem is serious and you have to
transplant, transplant into coarse sand or pure turface and hope for
the best. Otherwise, correct the under- or over-watering problem and
wait for the tree to recover.

Nina. The hurricane passed tranquilly over us, giving us a gentle
rain.

Anil Kaushik

Thank you very much Nina for the valuable information. I was also facing the same problem and thinning out of the foliage did help. I thing water-logging in the pot can also be a culprit. More observations on this problem will definitely help in finding t
he exact cause.

Anil

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