I'll tell you what I do, usually, if I am asked to do a demo I supply the demo material and I take it with me when I leave---most of the time. Generally it is the same with work shops, I supply the material or at least help in picking it out. Last year I did a work shop for a Michigan club. Part of that demo was centered around the art of picking out a suitable tree. We had the luxry of having the meeting at a very good nursery so we spent some time in the nursery picking trees. Fortunately there were some pretty good ones to choose from. It was a pretty rewarding experience. This same club is having me back again this year to finish the job started last year.

Then we have absolutely no problem, do we, Vance? My thread was about the bonsai abusers that seem to be making the circuit these days.

I agree with what you've said Chris. Earlier this year while planning a Master's visit there was a "discussion" about the demo. One board member was adamant that the demo include a potting the demo tree into a bonsai pot. It was discussed that we wouldn't be doing the tree any benefit by styling it but then forcing it into a bonsai pot at the wrong time. The whole discussion of are we showing the master's skills or just creating a tree for raffle that will die ensued. The dissenter would not change their view and said "If we're paying for a demo then I want a full demo including putting it a pot." The problem was solved by a member buying the tree for the demo with the knowledge that they would keep the tree afterwards and there would be no raffle.

I think there has to be a mindshift change from the "We've always done it this way" to working together with the Master and the clubs expectations for long term benefits.

Bill

Man, I wonder if I could name the miscreant in question?

Well, I guess since i took the time to read all these posts I should make a comment(s)

It was Pootsies comment that started me thinking. It APPEARED that he was not pleased with some workshop tree(s) and their outcome? Unless I'd read it wrong?
But, I gotta ask, did you pick the workshop for the stock or the name? I've seen some of the worst junk trees used for workshops given by "names" You sometimes have to decide which is more important, dropping a "name" or having nice stock! Sometimes you wanna check the material before you pick your "name".
I've heard people say that the point of workshops is gleening knowledge from a "master", if the plant survives that's just a PLUS. I , personally don't agree, I think you should have a living plant for your money and would NEVER use stock that was questionable at the end, but, I can see how some folks might agree with that statement. I guess it is a degree of what exactly you are after. and, are you experienced to grow it when done?

Demo's....I still love watching demos (when I get a chance at conventions) done by MOST people. I ALWAYS learn something new and new techniques and like to see their solutions to problems. I'm always hepped to get to work on stuff when I get home. Sometimes I can recognize a tree that doesn't have a chance in hell to survive but often it's not the tree or the work on it, but, the pilgrim who wins it in a raffle or bids in auction.

The new ABS idea is MORE than seminar, but instead a "Teaching symposium" more revolving around CLASSES than sit-and-watch demos.
Dale

Thanks, Dale I'd agree with most of what you said. The most important thing, though, is that real teaching be accomplished at every level. A proper demo might be demostrating a particular technique, like defoliating and pruning a trident maple in summer, or wiring correctly.

This has to come down to the individual club level, though. I walked up to a tree one day at our local club with the most godawful wiring I had ever seen. When I offered to help, the guy said he's been wiring for ten years and teaches wiring! Man, sometimes someone has to say something to these people!