Excellence (in bonsai & display) is the destination, artistry is the vehicle.

Regards,

Chris.

But for those of us that are ready(or at least think we are ready) to take that step, we need to know how to go about finding that artist, approaching him/her, and asking to be their protégé. Maybe if bonsai nurseries would offer workshops where one could work in a group setting with these artists. Or maybe they could even book time to work one-on-one with these artists.
Wow what a wonderful world that would be

(please insert sarcasm above)
Great post Will
Adam

Adam,

One secret is to simply ask them if you can be of assistance to them. I have friend that has volunteered his time and labor to private bonsai nurseries and the National Arboretum's bonsai staff. After several years, he has become a docent at the Arb. and helps with pruning, repotting, etc. He has worked on Naka's "Goshin" and has helped with maintenance chores with the old white pine pictured elsewhere on this site...

He didn't ask for any compensation, monetary or instructional. He merely asked if he could help out and watch the more advanced folks work...It's not formal instruction, but it has its rewards.

Colin Lewis has a 3 year bonsai school that he teaches at various venues in the US.
See http://www.hoyoku.com/ and click on "About the School" for details. It is a pretty good school. ( I got my diploma a couple months ago).
It's not free but well worth the bucks. And I do think most of us would agree that Colin falls into the master category.
I learned a lot in my three years with him.

There are also a few masters that post right here that have an excellent grasp of artistic design who could be very good sources for higher learning and they post this information for free. The problem is that I have seen a couple of them try to put forth these thoughts and were ignored or bombarded with statements such as "I'll do it my way" or "it is only a hobby so it doesn't matter."

First you need to admit that you are ready to take that next step, then admit that you know nothing about attaining that level of bonsai, empty your cup and finally, shut up and listen. Egos are the biggest deterrent to learning there is.

There are people here who kick out advanced but not artful bonsai and post them often yet never hear what is being said, in fact they get rather upset at anything except praise. There are people here who have not mastered the basic horticultural practices of container gardening, yet critique the work of those way beyond their own abilities. There are people here that actually have nothing more than seedlings in a bonsai pot that debate with the few real artists that we have here and can not be told that nothing they have is even remotely ready for a bonsai pot, let alone for a critique. There are people here who have never created an advanced bonsai or who can barely keep the sticks they have alive that actually give advice to newcomers. People who will give advice on subjects that they actually have no first hand experience with.

Take our Ask The Master forum here in example. How often do inexperienced people rush to comment there before Walter even gets a chance even though the rules are plainly posted for those who take the time to learn before they speak? How many times after Walter has critiqued the bonsai do others with less experience offer up contradicting advice? I have to hand it to Walter, he truly has the patience of the saints.

Strangely enough, it is the people who point these things out, the ones who scream that the emperor is not wearing any clothes that are called elitist snobs when in fact they are just beating a smoother path for all to follow.

I for one, am ready to take that next step, I know little about attaining that next artistic level of bonsai, and when members here such as Walter Pall, Jerry Meislik, Vance Hanna, Vance Wood, HB Smith, Candy Shirley, David Chauvin, Carl Bergstrom, Al Keppler, Attila, Fish, Brent, I.B. and others tell me that I am on the wrong path, I think I'll listen.


Will Heath

Very true but I feel that there is nothing like "hands on" training.
Not taking away anything from those that post here. We have some mighty good people , some of whom you have mentioned. But it is still just words and pictures on a computer screen. Not quite as good as setting down with one of those masters.
I realize that this might not be something that a lot of us can do. And that is a pity.
Not saying that one cannot learn from the internet. If that is all one can afford then I guess that would be called the best way.
But I do think that the next step you are talking about will take more than the internet.
One will have to make some sacrifices to get there. It will cost more than just time. A bit of money will have to go into the equation. And maybe a bit of travel.
It won't just come to you in the middle of the night )

Great attitude and one that I take myself. I posted some of my trees a while ago, got some good advice, and have started working to reach these goals. Once I am getting closer to these goals I will post again and see where I am at.


That was the point of my first post. The resources are there at every bonsai nursery (at least all the ones I have been to) All you have to do is pay the price and get the instruction. If someone isn't willing to pay at least some money to get themselves to that next level, and make the effort to get to the workshops/private lessons, they really aren't ready to move on.

Adam

Agreed, but let's not invalidate the experience and knowledge that is readily and freely offered right here.

I bet that if you figured the cost of receiving the same advice in person from the artists that I mentioned above in person, you'd be shocked. I am also willing to bet that when given in person they would receive a lot more respect and attention than they do here.

I can say with a certain amount of confidence that I will never spend a few years in Germany under the tutelage of Walter Pall, yet I have had the incredible good fortune to be able to listen to and learn from his wisdom here.

Vance will have the unenviable chore of having me for a student this spring (I think the members at the club have a pool going on exactly how long before he will go completely gray or completely postal.) However, I will not stop my studies here on the web either, where else after all can one learn from so many world renown artists at the same time?


Will

Am not belittling anything one can get here. Just stating the obvious. It would be better in person.That is a given.
Now for those that will never be able to afford to go to Germany or Japan or wherever all is not totally lost.
With a little bit of savings during the year. A few beers less, a missed golf game or even not upgrading your computer yearly can get you a lot.
Try hitting one of the major conventions that are in the US. Yes we do have them. Even if you can't afford to attend the workshops there is always the trees on display. You can study them, learn from them and start taking that next step.
Try learning what a good tree looks like. It is the first step towards becoming an artist.
Let me give you an example of what I am talking about.
Asheville NC has what is becoming a major US show. Not sure but I think that there has been about seven annual shows so far. I have attended everyone.
At these shows I have been able to not only see some pretty impressive bonsai but have also been able to see some good people do their thing. David DeGroot, Walter Paul, Rodney Clemmons, Davis Chipples (sp), Harry Tomlinson ( not too impressed there), Chase and Soli Rosade, Quinquan Zhao, even Yugi Yasumora Sp) before he died.
At the shows in Florida I got to watch Guy Guidry, Alan Keefer, Jim Smith , Jim Vanlandingham, Ed Trout , John Naka, Ben Oki and Jim Moody.
In Texas it was Craig Coussins.
Even got the chance to see Kamura and chat with him through his interpreter in Atlanta.
I got not only to watch them but have a chat with them over a beer. Some I even got some private lessons with.
Was all this a valuable learning experience. I guess one could say so. Either that or I was one dense SOB.;o)
Add all that to what I learned during my years with Jim Moody and Colin Lewis's school and I guess one could say that I have had a well rounded education. Might not have done much with it but I had it.
All those names does not mean that I know something. It just means that I have no excuse for not knowing at least a little bit.
Not everyone can go to Japan, etc. to study but that doesn't mean that you can't have a world class education.
You just have to be willing to go for it. Give up a little bit. Not a had thing to do if you really want it.
Guess I'll get off my high horse now. Hopefully I don't trip and bust my tukus.
The words might not have been totally right but the sentiment was at least there.