Mike, I believe 'kamikaze' was originally from a fortunate time as far as Japanese history is concerned. I'm only going from memory here, but as I recall the divine wind was in the form of a typhoon that drowned the invading Mongols? at the last moment, when it appeared that all hope was lost. Japan obviously hoped that history would repeat itself in WWII when this term was applied to the suicide dive-bombers.
zube

Vance, while I was writing you beat me to the punch!

Zube: Thanks for confiming what I have written.

Sword making in ancient Japan was a craft that became an art. Archery, a war craft became an art, flower arranging, serving tea, bonsai, etc etc etc.

The thing we miss the most in these discussions is indeed as Vance hinted at with kami. The inner peace, the zen, the do. To take the task at hand and put your all into it, to become one with it, to enjoy it's essence, to bring it to a perfectness.

This is where art transcends craft. Any man can pick up a concave cutter and practice a craft, some will be good at it, others not. It is the next step, the step that comes from the soul that leads one to creation, to art.

Again, the sole reason we wire, trim, prune, shape, spend hours looking for the perfect pot, etc is to bring the tree closer to art. If it was truly craft, why would we care? Just plant it into a Tupperware pot and let it grow.

The question is....without art, would there be bonsai?

No, just houseplants.

Great thread Vance!


Will

A lot of people take a craft seriously, I know several model boat builders that take the hobby seriously. Most try to do the best they can in any endeavor.
The use of "art" in this case is just a play on words.

the craft is in the doing

the art is in the viewing

Ron wrote: The use of "art" in this case is just a play on words.

Who says?
__________________

Me I guess )
Not sure that means much though.
Tell you what lets try this. Humor me at least this one time.
Define what an artist is. But limit that definition to bonsai.
My guess it would be something like this (based on what I keep reading here)
A talented person that can take a give commodity (tree) and through selective trimming and manipulation can create a thing of beauty
A very basic statement but would that be close to the definition.
I await your answer.

Oh, let me, let me...


An artist is one who creates art or makes a dedicated attempt to.

Okay Ron, now answer this one that you have been dancing around on a few different threads....

Would or could there be Bonsai without art?



Will