Bonsai Brawl!

imyerhukleberry

This proposition is for a new section either under General Bonsai Discussion, or under Best of bonsaiTALK.

Many of the threads in this forum evolve into large discussions not directly related to the topic of the thread, or Bonsai, yet are critical to better understanding many topics encountered in the practice of Bonsai.

The new section would provide an area of discussion for topics such as "Is Bonsai Cruel to Trees?" as well as, "The Oldest Living Bonsai".

I propose that the new section be named THINK TAKE or BONSAI BRAWL

...the new section is intended for free discussion or these passionate topics. Diversity and expression of new ideas would be encouraged.

This new section would allow for those passionates to sinergize and provide a place for extended debates and explorations to occur with in the forum.

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Will_Heath

Sounds like you're trying to banish some people out of general discussion....

imyerhukleberry

"Banish" is not really the word that best describes my proposition.

I am proposing a new area wich will provide a place for threads of in depth discussion of controversy.

Exile is not the intent here. Gathering thinkers, philosophers, and promoting sinergy of minds is more like the idea.

This for the most part already occurs in many different threads. Because it occurs in these threads it is considered "bird walking" or getting off the topic of the thread, or Bonsai in general. *L* hopefully members would not be "banished" to this area, but instead attracted to it for critical thinking.

TreeBay

Well thank you for the suggestion, but I don't see a lot of value in it at this moment. Maybe I don't fully understand what you have in mind.

The threads you mention are perhaps controversial, but they are among the most cohesive in terms of topic as any on the forum. We have a lot of forums here and IMHO, we really don't need one for threads that go longer than a couple dozen posts or elicit controversy. "Oldest Living Bonsai" was split in two a couple days ago by the way, so it is very topical throughout. The ensuing discussion "How old is a Tree" is very very topical now. I also think it's become very, very tiresome, but that doesn't mean it doesn't have value to someone.

I don't know exactly what THINK TAKE is supposed to mean, but BONSAI BRAWL, to me does not connote free thinking or synergy. It sounds more like, "BICKER HERE".

Regards,

Matt

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imyerhukleberry

I'd like to state that...

Recent Images
Special Events
Member Trees
Club Shows
Bonsai Auctions...do not have any posts...

...also...there have been times when a discussion was ended/banned/locked with out warning because it was actually controversial (such threads would fit this new forum well)...

...as far as "bickering" goes...I would welcome it...opinions are great...they are good because the stem discussion...opinions that are supported are even better...

Finally, I agree that "Bonsai Brawl" is probably not the best title for a forum. I do like the title "Think Tank" better, however, the title does not matter to me so much as that there be an area for such topics...

breefe

You pro-brawl forum folks realize there would be no one able to moderate the forum. I highly doubt Matt would do it(I wouldn't) and there is no one else qualified that wouldn't get right into it with the rest.

If you have something to say to someone...PM them, they will thank you and so will I. Some people may like to "watch" the conversations that get heated. I'm not sure if people getting very bitter and leaving is worth your entertaiment.

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Will_Heath

Correct me if I'm wrong.

Isn't the purpose of this forum to promote the knowledge and understanding of all things "Bonsai"? A place where beginning and advanced bonsaist can discuss techniques, procedures, ideas, experiences, thoughts, and the traditions of bonsai. Where we can share knowledge, pictures, and information while being part of a worldwide knowledge base.

From my experience, most heated discussions involve:
· Someone making a claim that they are unable to qualify with provable facts based on their experience.
· Someone who is unable to accept the facts.
· Someone asking for advice and then arguing when they hear something they didn’t want to hear.
· Someone pretending to possess knowledge that they do not.

I think Matt’s first answer to this was right on the money. A free forum means that you have only facts to communicate with, anything else will be called. This keeps us all honest and promotes a better forum.

Will Heath

TreeBay

Those topics are actually quick links to the Forum Gallery for those respective subjects. There isn't any way to post in them. I'm not really sure what your point is about that, could you elaborate, please?
I have to ask you to be specific about what you mean here. The only topics that get ended/banned/locked without notification or explanation are Announcements. edit: I have to add, I don't think I would wish any of the previously locked topics to be reopened around here anywhere, though. They were closed for a reason.
1. There is already an OPINION section of BEST OF BONSAITALK that captures a lot of threads of this sort after they run their course. I think you might find it interesting. Might have to look further back in there than the current display window, because most threads would be older than 3 months or so.

2. We might encourage folks to use the SOUND OFF post icon to denote posts that are strongly opinionated or controversial. I marked a couple of those earlier today.

Regards,

Matt

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imyerhukleberry

I agree, the Opinion section is the closest in relation to what I propose. Maybe it is the name that kills it.


One example of a thread that was locked is "Is Bonsai Cruel to Trees"
...I really didn't see any reason for that thread to be locked...maybe because it got a bit off the topic of Bonsai?

Another example of a thread wich was locked was one wich was posted in the General section that had to do with a squierrel problem...I did not see a good reason to lock that one either...unless it was because it got a bit off the topic of Bonsai...

...now that I think about it TreeBay, administrators must have a list of these locked threads...I'm sure that if one looks into this they'll find that for the most part these threads were locked because they are related to Bonsai, but for one or another reasons got off topic........it is threads such as these wich I am requesting for "Think Tank"......

...I would like to add that any discussions in such a forum I would hope would be rational......I also do not like bickering, irrationality, name calling, and all the other childish things that sometimes enter some of these threads...humor is always welcome ofcourse...



Well...yes Will...your examples occur a lot of times in discussion...all the reason to have more of them would'nt you agree?

...an ignorant person will encourage discussion, and if they are only ignorant, and not actually stupid as well, then they'll learn from the discussion...