Young Elm tree

Maveri9720

Hi all. I found this young Elm tree growing in a flower pot that the flowers had died in and was just sitting outside for a year. I went to empty the pot and put new flowers in it and I found this little guy growing in it.

So last summer, I pruned the roots and repotted it into this pond basket and put it into some bonsai soil.

My question is: What do I do with it? I was thinking of chopping the trunk in half or so to encourage more growth in the trunk area, but I also read that leaving it grow out will increase the trunk the best.

So I am a little confused as to what to do. Do I let it grow for a couple more years, or start trying to train it now? It also has a big bulge in the trunk right at the soil level. Is this even worth trying to make something out of?

All comments, advice, info and photoshops would be most appreciated. I would say the tree is close to being 1 3/4 - 2 years old.

Thanks.

Attached Images

	Elm Tree.jpg (36.2 KB, 110 views)
	Elm Tree 2.jpg (32.8 KB, 101 views)

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Repotter

I started with the wild Elms and Mulberry trees in the back yard. That was my learning time and they did very well. I suggest pruning the top to the height you want and then pruning the branches/leaves always leaving two sets of leaves on the branch.
This way you can select branching while allowing it to ramify plus reducing leaf size.

It is a great tree to experiment on since they grow so fast. I kept mine under ten inches tall and they had a 1/2 to 3/4 inch trunks after two years.

Good luck,....Hec

www.tellys.com

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bwaynef

Sorry to confuse the matter, but I'd suggest just the opposite. Let it grow out ...as tall as it wants to. You can always chop the trunk back and have it throw out buds everywhere along the remaining trunk. You can develop the branches after you've got a trunk to grow them on.

WF

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Brent

How long to let it grow? When to chop?

These are always the most difficult questions for beginners. The answer is simple and complex at the same time. The short answer is: Let it grow until the base is as big as you want it to be, or nearly so, at least 2/3 of the desired finished caliper. Why? If you chop it sooner, you won't get a lot of taper, and you slow down the process needlessly.

The difficult part about this decision is that most beginners have NO idea how big a bonsai they want (height and caliper), because they don't yet have enough exposure to imagine even these most fundamental parameters. So, that's where you begin, imagining what you want it to look like. Feel free to cheat and look at pictures and real bonsai, that's how you learn.

Chances are you will still get it wrong (your design won't result in a believable bonsai). So let me suggest a cardinal principle that you should have tattooed across your forehead: Decide on a base thickness (in inches or cm) and make the tree six times taller than that. For most beginners, this will be absurd, because they are imagining bonsai from sticks in pots. Six to one would result in a tree 1 1/2 inches tall. But I am telling you, unless you want bonsai you need magnifiers to see you need a one inch trunk for even the SMALLEST bonsai.

From this base section you grow the rest of the tree repeating the chop process. It's really not that difficult, but it will help if you read the TRUNKS article at my website.

I can hear all the arguments coming about rules, guidelines, freedom of expression, exceptions, etc, but I am addressing beginners here, and I think they are best served if they have a firm foundation that will give them a likelihood of success. There are still plenty of opportunities for creativity for even your first tree.

Brent
EvergreenGardenworks.com
see our blog at http://BonsaiNurseryman.typepad.com

007

I see what both Brent and WF are saying . . . if this tree were destined to become a specimen tree, then yes letting the tree grow out until the trunk is near the desired caliper is the way to go, and something for the beginner to keep in mind as their skills develop.

But what I think that Repotter is trying to say is to take this tree as a learning tree . . . experiment with it, get comfortable with its care (i.e. watering, light, pruning for direction, etc.) before attempting training which I think is the best way to go. THEN go out and buy that specimen tree . . .

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Maveri9720

Thanks everyone for your time and advice. It is most appreciated, as always.


I will take the advice and let the tree grow untouched until the desired trunk thickness is achieved.

Thank you for sharing your experience Repotter.

It's very hard to see a tree everyday and be able to control the urge to chop it up and start training it. But for now, I will resist and let it grow more.

Is there anything that I can do in the meantime while it grows? Or does it need to be totally untouched for the next year or two? I will fertilize, but other than that, just watering.

Thanks again all.

007

If you are simply trying to increase trunk size, than don't touch it. Just watch it grow . . . which is why I suggested to start training and experimenting with things now. This tree was free to you, is a common species which is easily replaced, and is quite forgiving which to me presents an excellent opportunity to do some experimentiation and learning . . . I think that one of the biggest turn offs for newbies in this hobby is the boredom of waiting for that trunk from immature stock. You've gotta ask yourself . . . "Is this tree going to turn into a magnificent specimen?"

My advice? Prune away some branches, try some wiring, experiment with fertilizing routines, pinch out buds and see what happens . . . just play with this tree. Once you've mastered these techniques, then go out and find yourself some decent stock.

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IdahoBonsai

Yeah, get more trees. If you have many trees, then the time you spend agonizing over each individual diminishes. What you have to do have balance though. You don't want so many that they start to be neglected either.

I have 1.6 acres and 500+ trident maple seeds in the fridge...

I'ma gonna be a VERY distracted boy!

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South Central Idaho

Maveri9720

As of right now, I have 11 pieces / 20 trees, not including the Elm, so I have plenty of other trees to play with. It isn't a matter of inexperience with bonsai that I want to play with this tree, it is a lack of experience in having potensai.


About 1/2 of what I have are older trees that have had training done to them and are in the later stages of their training. The other half, minus the Elm, are in the post-beginner / pre-intermediate stages of training.


Having something this young is brand new for me. I would like this tree to mature and become a nice piece to my collection. It would be a first for me to have a tree from seedling to maturity and would be a nice accomplishment.

So I would rather not chop and trim and wire on this tree just for the experience of it, b/c I get enough of that with my other trees. I am just new to young specimens and how to care for them.

I should have stated earlier that I am not a complete newb and that this isn't my first tree, so for that I apologize.

But again, thank you for everyone's advice and info. I am always trying to learn more.

Thanks.