Red Pine

joelewko

This Red Pine was given to me recently. It is in it's 60's, the previous owner was not sure of its exact age, although he has owned it for 8 years. In the picture, you'll notice some dead branches, and the fact that the caniopy seems a bit empty. This is due to the fact that this tree almost died one winter a few years back. In fatc, the last owner thought it was dead, and almost threw it out. However, he noticed soem new green growth (good thing too!), and he said the canopy has been recovering more and more every year ever since. This is the tree as of now, with the front being pictured first.







This is a quick virt i did, with a possible direction for the tree. The white represents what will be jinned. It's hard to see form the picture, but a branch is coming toward the viewer, and the white line there will be the jin. You can see this branch better form the back of the tree. Any thoughts and comments are welcome, and much appreciated, as i feel this tree needs a good amount of work. (The owner said it might be potbound, and i lifted the tree today, and the entire rootmass+soil lifted out of the pot easily, and held the square shape of the pot, so it will need to be repotted soon. I took a picture when i lifted it, and i'll upload that hopefully tomorrow).

Joe

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darrellw

I think this is how I would go.

Attached Images

pinevirt.jpg (72.9 KB, 96 views)

bridge

My thoughts as well FWIW.

joelewko

sorry it took a little longer than anticipated, but here is a picture of the rootmass when I slid it out of the pot. This is underneath, with the front of the mass towards the top. I think this is in need of a repotting in the spring, but I am a little nervous to rootpruning, as I ahve said before this tree didn't do so well a while back, and I don't want to kill it. How are pines with recovering with rootpruning? I read somewhere that you don't need to "balance" the foliage with the roots, the tree does that itself. How true is that statement? Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.



Joe

P.S. I'm sorry the picture doesn't enlarge

Graydon

Don't be nervous about root pruning a pine. Pines recover well after root pruning if you keep a couple of things in mind like the timing of the pruning and keeping plenty of top growth to aid in the recovery. I don't subscribe to the balance top and bottom growth concept. I believe in doing root work one year and major top work on another year. Simple maintenance can be performed on the top during a root work year.

Root activity and growth can be linked to a couple of major growth periods with a pine. One is the elongation of spring shoots (buds to candles) and a late summer to fall setting of the candles. If the root pruning were to be carried out at one of these times you would have the bast chance for survival and recovery. Note that the pruning needs to happen just before this period of growth so that you are not removing roots that just grew or are starting to grow.

Based on that photo I can agree you need to repot and remove unwanted surface roots and tangled or circling roots. Many people advocate doing this in 2 steps over 2 years. In other words they remove the soil as needed on one side and work on the roots leaving the other half intact. You need to pay special attention to the area around the trunk and below the trunk and put in fresh and fast draining soil to avoid rot and stale soil.

I think you have an interesting trunk and that there could be a nice tree in there but it may require so major work and perhaps some grafting. If this tree were mine I would ignore everything except getting it repotted and let it grow unchecked for one year.

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joelewko

Thanks for the comments Graydon,

I was actually thinking about doing what you suggested (nothing but repotting), so it's good we're on the same page. Well, now that i think about it, that's not 100% true. I was actually going to jin some of the dead branches that were left behind (when the tree almost died), but i am relitively new to jinning/pines, so i have a few questions (not just for Graydon, for anyone). First, when is the best time to do this. I don't think it matters because the branches are dead, but i'm unsure, hence why i'm asking. Also, (i think i know the anser to this but i'll ask anyway) if i leave a dead branch, it will eventually rot right?

I also have a question about a product i read about on a Bonsai retail site called super-thrive. The person selling it claimed that using it after repotting would help reduce the stress on the tree and aid on recovery. Has anyone used this product before? If so, is it worth buying?

Thanks in advance for your comments and time,

Joe

darrellw

Hi Joe,

You are right, if the branch is already dead it really does't matter when you work on it. If you are going to try pulling fibers from the dead branch, you might want to try to soak them beforehand (remove the bark, then wet for a few days).

Dead branches will rot, but pines are very resinous, so they resist rot well. Also, having the dead wood out of contact with the soil helps a lot (to keep it drier).

-Darrell

bonsaikc

You need to find a smaller tree in this one. Notice the trunk line to the first fork, follow it to the left to the next fork, then right again. You can fairly easily turn this into a nice informal upright if you will graft new branches at opportune points, then reduce the tree when they begin to get strong. You could even go shorter than that by using a graft to form a new apex about halfway up from that first bend I mentioned.

I'd diagram it for you but your photos are too large to upload to this system.

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Chris Johnston
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Graydon

NO! No Superthrive on pines.

The best thing you can do is dilute fish emulsion and let nature do what it does. Superthrive damages or kills the mycorrhizal fungi which grow with the roots of all pines (and many other trees).

See bonsaikc's web site as he has a great article on repotting pines and shows a well colonized pine root ball with the fungus present. You need this symbiotic relationship for the pine to continue to get better and prosper.

I'll post more on jins if needed later - I just wanted to catch you before you started using the Superthrive.

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