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4 Weeks Ago
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#1 |
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bonsaiTALK Master
Join Date: Jul-2006
Location: massachusetts
Country: United states
Posts: 350
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Beautifully flawed, opinions wanted
Hello everyone,
I purchased this tree last week. It is a shimpaku juniper, literati. I went back to the nursery with the tree yesterday to prune and repot it and also for a workshop. While I was working on the tree, Master Hiromi Tsukada was potting up a huge, probably 300 year old pine. As you may or may not know. Master Tsukada is considered by many, the number one bonsai azalea artist in the world and currently instructing at NE Bonsai Gardens. Mr Tsukada was about to repot was about 3 1/2 feet tall and about 4 1/2 feet long. It was a semi cascade. The tree was probably up near 300 years old. I had noticed that the tree might require a second pair of hands so I offered my assistance to him. So I held this humongous tree in place while he stepped back several times to look for the best view. He found it and then wired it in while I held it in place. He smiled and said "thank you". A little while later, he saw me working on my tree, I was just getting it into its new pot and then I was going to start pruning. He came over and looked at the tree. At this point the tree was placed in the pot and loosely wired for the moment. He cannot speak english so I was concerned that If he offered instruction, I would not be able to understand it. However, he knows a little english. He asked me "front". I said yes. He asked me "back branch", I said yes. Then he made a gesture to turn the pot. It was a literati pot that had 3 feet. I initially had the 2 feet in the front. He made the gesture again to keep turning until 1 foot was in the center in the front. I did so and then he said, " I like this front". I initially had the idea of planting the tree planted on about a 35 degree slant to the right. Then he said ' stand here", so I could view it. He walked over to the tree and put his hand in the middle of the trunk and said, " this straight", then put his hand on the base and said "this straight". Then he moved the tree into a straight position. So I went over to the tree and held it while he stepped back and looked. Then he traced the movement of the tree with his hand and stood back. He looked and said "nice". Then he said, " now center". So I centered it and tied it in. He looked again and said "nice"". At that point, John, my bonsai teacher walked in and saw the tree and said that sublime could be a word used to describe this tree. Well, here is the tree, a before pic and then the afters. The afters are after pruning the entire tree and then some fine wiring. This tree has a few flaws. One, is that the trunk is kind of straight for a literati. Two, the main, or what look like main branches on the left and right, are actually a front branch with the sub branching divided to look like left and right side branches. I may still jin some branches. Also, concerning the back branch at the bottom. I was all ready to jin it, but I did a photo shop virt of it without that branch and I also used my hands to hide it and it actually seemd to take away the balance from the tree. I am not sure that the branch should be removed. Even if the rules may lean towards it. It seems that the branch is counter balancing the weight of the top of the tree. I would also like to add that I cannot really take credit for the styling of this tree. This tree is probably over 40 years old and about 2 feet tall. Whoever had it before must have trained it for years and years to get this look, flawed or not. Also, the ramification is exquisite. I would love to hear as many thoughts as possible about this tree. |
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Beautifully flawed, opinions wanted |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#2 |
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bonsaiTALK Journeyman
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Rob is one of my better students because HE is motivated and does all the work to make his bonsai beautiful. I am very impressed with the conscientiousness in detail and care that he exhibits on all his trees.
OK, now the tree. I looked at this tree over and over and contemplated buying it myself. It is an exquisite literati bonsai and sublime in its appearance. Many have overlooked it because of it's very straight ascension upwards. But that is what gives it a sense of wabi sabi. Rob has thinned it out quite well but I would thin it a bit more on the heavier lower left side branching. (the picture of the tree on the brick patio has a lighter appearance - shadows in the two photo's with the scroll make the foliage seem heavier than they actually are). The pot is a pretty good choice but I might choose one with lighter or no feet. (It is always difficult to find the perfect pot when you need one!) Lastly, Rob, when displaying the tree with a scroll, it should be placed on the left side of the scroll with the trees direction facing towards the scroll. (and then add a balancing complementary accent plant on the right side for an assymetrical display). John Romano |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#3 |
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Bonsai Evangelist
 
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Rob,
I like this tree a lot- it is truly an excellent literati. It has real flow and balance. It is nice to see that this tree is not over-potted and is very well placed. I think what John was getting to is what "bothers" (that is an overstatement but insinuates what I feel) me is the "over-ramificaton" (did I say that on Bonsai talk?) that this tree exhibits. It seems to have been pinched to increase foliage density, an established and well accepted technique that doesn't work well with this tree. Once you get the foliage to be more spare (after it recovers from repotting) and "open" by twig and branchlet pruning coupled with light fine wire work, it will be extremely nice. Very, very, nice and thanks for posting this fine tree. John (Keep the low branch it gives it an appearance of the age it was formed- the 60's to 80's.)
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"Wiring is simple; However, it is not easy to do it right" Boon |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#4 |
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bonsaiTALK Master Craftsman
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I love it.....you ask me why
I don't knoww, I don't know |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#5 |
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Perpetual Learner
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Any comments I make would be in agreement with all other poster's.
It is a very nice example of Bunjingi. The lowest branch sets the feeling of beauty.
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PUP Advanced begginner Heatzone USA9/10 Aus 3/4 |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#6 |
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bonsaiTALK Expert
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Nice tree.... My comments fall right in line with Mr. Kirby's....too much foliage. I think it would look much better with a much thinner and less pad like apperance.
Good job! Jason
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Jason's Bonsai Fun! www.oregonbonsai.com USDA Zone 8, NW Oregon 1.20.09 Texas gets the villiage Idiot back!!!! |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#7 |
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Bonsai Master, in my mind
Join Date: Feb-2005
Location: Back Home in Northern California
Country: USA
Posts: 1,482
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G’day Rob…
Nice bonsai…nicely done… However…even though I haven’t had the privilege of seeing it up close and personal, and in spite of the remarks from John Romano and John Von, here’s my first impression of what I might do…IF IT WERE MY BONSAI… To bring this bonsai into the restrictions of my perception of what I a bunjin should look like…in addition to the already proposed thinning of the foliage, I might remove the three lowest branches…leaving stubs that may or may not be jinned. Then I might even do a little more thinning of the foliage. With bonsai, bunjin means little is better… N'est-ce pas…? Pat
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BONSAI isn't about surviving in a storm, rather, how to dance in the rain. THE ONLY WAY: Always remember, and don't ever forget, that whatever you read here is not cast in concrete... the intent of any advice is to help. In no way should you feel that I’m saying that my way is the only way…heaven forbid! I've seen far too much of the "my way or the highway" attitude in bonsai as well as in other areas of life. Pat Patterson...Bonsai in the Greater Bay Area, Northern California
Last edited by PatArizona : 4 Weeks Ago at 06:38 AM. |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#8 |
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bonsaiTALK Craftsman
Join Date: Oct-2005
Posts: 73
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Why don't you get one of those handy Literati form kits. You just drop it in and it chops off all the branchs that do not fit the form leaving stubs which can be sharpened to points with the special pencil sharpener included in the kit. The name of the kit is Literati by the Numbers and comes with a step by step guide to making a genuine Literati.
OR Look for and enhance any unique or interesting feature you find such as the the first low branch that fellow kit owners want you to lop off. It is not just that the pads need thinning, and they do, but they are begging to be wired and shaped so they no longer resemble lollipops. The jins or stubs fit the kit so I would address them too. I hope you can save it from the "kit". Marka |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#9 | |
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Registered FedEx Sender
 
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Quote:
While I share your enthusiasm for that most important low branch, I don't think there was any call for the tone of your post. Artists and hobbyists have different visions for trees. Some are more artistically inclined or trained than others. There are popular bonsai artists whose work I find seriously flawed or inconsequential. No reason to disparage. The only thing this tree needs is a little more thinning and separation. Don't pinch it, prune and wire. There has been terrific discussion about this technique taught by Boon, by Brent, Vonsgardens, etc. While the trunk is a little straight, it does not look artificial, which is the kiss of death with a literati. And, the bottom branch is absolutely essential to the composition. Never let it fail. It is a beautiful tree. Congratulations. |
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4 Weeks Ago
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#10 | |
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New World Samurai
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Quote:
Principal: Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul. 
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Holding pasts in ash black earth Bound by roots Roots into sand Grow towards the giver |
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