When Did You Know You Had It?

Cre8tive

I am curious about different views/stories, primarily but not exclusively from more experienced members, dealing with when they reached the point where they felt proficient at creating a convincing tree. View from less experiences bonsai lovers are absolutely welcome as well. I am purposely avoiding placing labels on the level of talent (i.e. master) and the quality of bonsai (i.e. finished) that would produce debate or invoke modesty from those who probably have valuable inputs to offer.

Not having reached a substantial level of confidence in bonsai myself, I can only attempt to give examples of what I think this thread would be about. It would be interesting to know things such as: how many trees, years, dollars, spouses, classes, and how many times the towel has been thrown in only to be picked up again later to name a few. Just kidding about spouses! ; )

I am fishing for good stories more than anything.

Regards,
Mark

__________________
ART - An object or event that evokes an aesthetic reaction—a sense of beauty, appreciation, harmony, and/or pleasure; the quality, production, expression, or realm of what is beautiful or of more than ordinary significance; the class of objects subject to aesthetic criteria

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TpaBayFlyFisher

One night in college I had a dream. In it I was holding a little tree in one hand.............next weekend on my way to a new restaurant, there it was, a billboard on the side of the road-a tree in a hand. Honest to gosh, no drinking was involved! Well the next day I got up and visited the place advertised and was shocked. There were hundreds of little trees. The elderly lady that ran the nursery was quite nice and invited me to her beginner's class and gave me the names of some books to read. For the next 2 years I visited nearly every weekend and began to shape my own. Off to law school, and what luck! In the area was a world class artist. She was thrilled that a young student started showing up. After 3 years, I was helping shape her stock and maintain her show trees. Over the 20 years since I have loved the peace that comes with growing bonsai. It is the single thing that I do that is not a competition. It does not matter if anyone else sees my trees or likes them-I do. I also enjoy visiting artists around the country and seeing their work. I am not embarrassed to buy a nice tree that someone else has created, nor to give one of mine away. The pleasure is in the doing.......

ChrisM

mark, this is just my opinion of course, but i don't know that any of us can reach this point of which you speak. i'm surer than the sky is blue that i have not, but, with this art/hobby of ours, i think that one can finish a styling session, or a clean up and still look at the tree wondering or knowing that there is something else that can be done to make it better (ie. branch placement, pot, etc.). that being said, the proficiency of some of the members of this forum is without question impressive. i really like the basis of this thread and am looking forward to reading what some of the members of which i speak may say about the topic.

chris

__________________
A bonsai is like a good marriage.You commit, for better or for worse, till death do you part. I DO!!!

Moni

Mark, I have been dabbling with bonsai for about 15 years and I still consider myself a beginner mainly because of what Chris just said. I continue to see room for improvement, so all of my bonsai are works in progress. At least to me. I have taken many classes over the years and joined societies here and there. There is always more to learn. But I find this such a release from stress. Let's see. At this point I have about 20 trees. Itty bitty ones. My bigger ones I have given away because I am moving coast to coast. Oregon to Massachusetts. I moved my smaller trees into little 4" plastic pots to prepare them to be mailed right before I leave. This was heartbreaking. Needless to say, my bigger ones were my more "finished" ones and could not be downsized. Now I have about 20 small plants, most of which I do not even consider bonsai, yet. Oh dear.
But in the last few years I have gotten into digging up native plants in my area and seeing how they "do" for bonsai. I have had some fun successes and some failures. We all have failures. I think that is the main thing for someone new at this to realize. You learn from your failures. Then when you try again and it works.......eureka! What a delight!
Moni

clrosner

To Mark and this esteemed group:

You never know if you have made it, if you are just enjoying trees for yourself. But this is what I do. I do not feel guilty about being selfish. I enjoy being alone with my trees.. Not that I don't post pictures and await the criticism, but that is as far as I will go to share my trees with my fellow Bonsaists.

I have been at this wonderful mental relaxing hobby for over seven years, and have studied (even took the course written by Tom Zane of the ABS) and read many books. But most of my education has been on the Internet.

I have taken several workshops and watched a few wonderful demonstrations.

I feel confident that I am able to keep my tropical and sub tropical trees alive, but that is the extent of my expertise.

I awaken every morning, and I am thrilled just to be able to go outside and be alone with my trees and enjoy the morning examination of each and every tree.

I must admit I do not feel the kinship to the Masters of China or Japan who create those speciments with which most of us drool.

After months of studying a tree, I am content to be able to style my trees as I see it. The images are imprinted on my brain, after viewing thousands of photographs and seeing trees at Long Wood Gardens (in Pennsylvania) and at the Mid-Atlantic Conventions.

The most valuable experience to me, was to Spend a week with Ron Martin at his last Summerville Festiville, where I met many wonderful Bonsai Artists, including the late Jim Moody. They all inspired me to enjoy my hobby in my own way.

__________________
Carl L. Rosner - near Atlantic City zone 6/7
arteacher3725@yahoo.com

CHECK OUT MY UPDATED WEBSITE AT[B]:
www.carlrosner.com

Cre8tive

I tried to leave the criteria vague in hopes of avoiding debates on precise definitions of who fits into this category and who doesn’t. From all the posts I have viewed on this site as well as the gallery, I would say there are many here who qualify.

Perhaps an analogy would be better.

Many people play guitar. Some people can only play the first few bars of several popular songs (you know who you are). Some know many of the cords and can pick their way through some sheet music. Some can’t read a note of music but can join in and accompany almost any other musicians after only listening to a few bars. Some get multi-million record deals. Finally, my point—each of these types of guitarist would have differing opinions as to whether or not they are musicians or how talented they might be. My intent is not to decide which of these categories qualify. I just want to know the story behind those who feel they can play some music.



When did you know you had it?

Regards,
Mark

__________________
ART - An object or event that evokes an aesthetic reaction—a sense of beauty, appreciation, harmony, and/or pleasure; the quality, production, expression, or realm of what is beautiful or of more than ordinary significance; the class of objects subject to aesthetic criteria

ChrisM

mark, to the point of your analogy, we can all play the music!! thats the great thing about bonsai. as a musician, i can relate to your analogy as if it were my life (and in part it is). see i am a singer who can play a few cords on the guitar, but never on stage, that is my guitarists job. but to your point, i don't much think it matters to what skill level the guitarist plays, as long as he/she has the drive to continue doing so, the passion to gain expierience, and above all else, loves what they do. i think that is what bonsai offers to everyone. i posed a very similar question to kenji miyata in my session with him, mainly about his vast knowledge and expierience, i believe his answer can respond to your original question nicely. kenji said simply that he is always learning. this is a man who creates beautiful masterpieces that we all strive to achieve and, in keeping with carls comments, i believe bonsai is what you make it, what you let it mean to you, if you are happy with what your imagination and talents can produce, you have it. again, i am not trying to debate, as i know you did not intend for this to be, this is just my opinion. as far as your comment about "fitting into a category", i believe that true art (which bonsai in part is) is all in the eye of the artist and the beholder, categories don't mean anything unless you use them to support your proffession (ie. kenji, walter, and many others), in which case they have earned them through the knowledge and expertise they share with all of us.

chris

__________________
A bonsai is like a good marriage.You commit, for better or for worse, till death do you part. I DO!!!

Will_Heath

After a job change about 12 years ago that required lots of overtime and sometimes being gone for days at a time, I lost all of what I then called "Bonsai"

Four years later I was bowhunting in Michigan here and while walking down a two track I noticed a tamarack on the side of the trail. It had been ran over numerous times and broken a few times also thoughout the years. It was in effect the closest thing to a natual bonsai I have ever seen. I was back the next day with limited knowledge and a shovel, it survived and still thrives to this day.

That single larch rekindled my interest. I now have a few bonsai that are "finished" in the sense that I only keep them trimmed in shape and repot every few years. I have about 20 that will be in that state within a few years and dozens of collected trees that are a long ways away. I also have a few purchased trees that I am retraining to fit my personal taste.

I still have limited knowledge.

I guess that a jack pine that I collected was when I knew I had somewhat of a gift for at least keeping trees alive and looking like trees in nature. The DNR here was bulldozing a track of land and in a huge pile of derbis I found a remarkable little jackpine that I rescued and potted in a training pot. 5 years later I moved it into a bonsai pot. I spend every morning before work drinking a coffee and staring at this little example of nature.

This "peace of mind" we find within the trees, this zen (if you will)caught ahold of me for the first time with the larch and tugged me everytime I lost a tree, it is now a part of me. Knowledge will come with time and as my little trees have taught me....I have time.

Cre8tive

Thanks BadByte for putting aside modesty and embracing the concept of this thread.

Regards,
Mark

__________________
ART - An object or event that evokes an aesthetic reaction—a sense of beauty, appreciation, harmony, and/or pleasure; the quality, production, expression, or realm of what is beautiful or of more than ordinary significance; the class of objects subject to aesthetic criteria