just a couple questions for anyone....

BlackDeathTuna

just had a couple of questions for someone who might know.

1. i was wonderingif one has a tree that one is trying to let grow out, i.e. trunk development should one prune? im figuring that i should keep leafing and branches down to a minimum on trunk and close to it, yes? just to prevent reverse taper right?

2. what are the results of defoliating and leaving foliage only out towards the tips of a branch within reason of course, would this promote outward growth and longer branches or would the tree just put out new leaves where they had been removed?

3. just started organic fertilizers month ago and am really impressed, darker leaves, etc. fertilizing with blood meal and bone meal but wondering if any had a good suggestion on a source for potash (k)?

thanks not really important questions just things i am wondering about at work while im waiting to get home to the trees...

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TreeBay

I'll try to respond as I can

1. There are several types of growth; Height, girth and taper, movement, ramification for example. It's somewhat an unreasonable expectation to attempt to develop more than say 2 of these at any time... and that can be stretching it. If you want the tree to grow thick in girth, don't prune it at all. If you want it to grow tall, remove the side shoots. If you want it to develop movement, wire it, or prune the apex to a side branch. If you want to develop taper, leave low branches, especially where you want the trunk thickest in a relative sense. If you want ramification, you'll need to prune lanky terminal growth and drive growth back in to encourage backbuds and short internodes. That can be difficult to achieve in the ground, and a lot of unnecessary work if you are refining branches that will be sacrificed later.

So, I guess you've figured that many of these ideas are at odds with each other? Hence, the need for a controlled program for development, doing the right thing at the right time. For example, there are a lot of bonsai that were grown freely during early development, and they develop thick trunks but little taper. Then they go into bonsai pots and grow slowly and develop refined apices and branches, but that cylindrical trunk is always still there. One can't ignore the importance of that interim period, in healing wounds and developing taper prior to advanced development if the goal is quality trees.

2. This topic of defoliating and leaving some growth at the tips is discussed in one of the issues of Bonsai Today as a method to develop some refinement in the branch while still allowing it to thicken somewhat. You won't get the close internodes at the unpruned tip. That's an area you can plan to sacrifice later. I believe this method was described for use with maples in particular

3. Blood and bone meal are great for this, unless your trees are vegetarians.

These are great questions and they show you are thinking!

Regards,

Matt

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BlackDeathTuna

i need advice then or maybe a gentle shove and some help in developing a long term goal for my trees, all of which are young and still working on trunks and nebari.

ive been reading and rereading all the information i can get my hands on, and the thing that i keep running into is that it seems really broad and general which i unserstand the reasons why but i thinking it would help if i could post a tree and get several peoples very specific feedback on what they would do and when everything from a fertilizing schedule to what they would do to move the tree closer to being a bonsai....
so here's my tree, if anyone feels adventurous enough to try be my guest...\

it a trident maple 4-5 years old, potted in run of the mill bonsai soil. it's about a foot tall and 15 inches wide, the trunk is about 3/4 of an in.

the picture is from a week or two ago and the tree has leafed out and is doing quite well sorry maybe i can work on a newer picture tomorrow?

Attached Images

trident.jpg (68.1 KB, 50 views)

bwaynef

That tree looks like a Japanese Maple (A. palmatum, not A. buergerianum). A 4-5 year old Trident would be a lot bigger than that, even if grown totally in THAT pot. I have Trident seedlings that are just in their 2nd year that are that big, and have a little more branching on them.

I say this because what you can do with a Trident is a LOT different than what a Japanese Maple will tolerate.

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LostHawken

I'm new too, but here's my plan...feel free to point out the flaws all...

I've got a maple that's a few years behind yours. I recieved it as a sapling "stick in a pot" I planted it in the ground and let it grow last summer. I pinched back the top most shoots trying to get branching lower down on the trunk, this was likely a waste of time and the tree's energy. I moved the tree to a plastic pot for the winter, and cut the trunk back to the third undeveloped bud this spring to get taper started and induce the growth of some sacrificial branches. I also tipped the pot to make the trunk line grow curved. I'm about to move now, but as soon as I get the chance I'll be putting it back in the ground (with some nebari prep) and let everything but bar branches grow, and trunk chop accordingly to increase taper and prevent reverse taper until I'm satisfied with the trunk shape. Then I'll likely remove most of the branches and grow the final ones from scratch.

My guess is that your tree could use some free growth and sacrificial branches depending on the style your going for. I'd probably cut the trunk back to those lowest bar branches next spring, after letting it go this summer, and then see where it goes from there, focusing only on trunk shape.

2 cents from a beginner to get the ball rolling.

~JG