Ginkgo?

TreeBay

>I knew this would cause a flamewar

I personally find it disappointing to be accused of contributing to a flamewar, so I am going to stay out of this thread altogether. I don't have time and energy for discourse in an environment where folks infer hostile intent on others engaged in honest debate.

Regards,

Matt

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Frogboy

NOT YOU, MATT!!

You've been utterly respectful at all times, I know you are always open to honest discourse. That's why I quoted earthgirl. I'm with you, I think there's no call for rude comments when we are searching for real answers. There's no reason to get upset because someone doesn't accept your answer as gospel, and you never do.

Paul Phillis

I think that Gingko have a flame shaped style is because they are traditionaly not wired and their natural growth is vertical. This gives a compromise flame shape under training.

Their are two pictures of beautiful Gingko in two books I have. I think that scanning them and posting the pic's is probably bad practice, so I'll qoute them and you'll just have to look them up for yourselves.

1) Image 54; "Masterpieces of Bonsai" Shufunotomo/Japan Publications, 1986

2) Image 55; "Classic Bonsai of Japan" Nippon Bonsai Association, 1989

Both trees are flame shaped.

One of the aims with Gingko is to obtain "Elbows" or aerial roots, which hang from the lowest branches. Age is the problem, it takes years for the elbows to develop. The other thing is wonderful autumn yellows.

I think that Gingko should also be on the large size of things to keep leaves and twig size in perspective, anywhere from 3 - 4 feet seems to work for me.


Paul

EarthgirlOK

Frogboy;

I certainly didn't intend to be "flamey(flamewar)." Sorry if I offended you. I wasn't sure what you were asking, given the answer that Matt (and I) offered. I guess I should have said that. I forget how intentions don't always come across in a posting.

Those are impressive examples you post, and some I haven't been able so find in my own searches to educate myself about this tree.

However, they do, at least to my eyes, resemble the flame-style bonsai I've seen, only more filled out.

Filled out; ginkgos don't ramify as easily as do other trees until they are quite old (IMHO). So I guess I'd agree with the answers ofthe others so far. I'll be curous to see if there are any other answers to come.

O.k.?

Michelle

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bonsaimaniac

I will start this answer by stating that I love ginkgo trees. I do not like the "flame" look that ginkgo bonsai are grown in. I think that it really takes away from the strength ginkgos show in nature. The long branches outlined with leaves. That being said this was brought up the other day on another site. The reasoning behind the "flame" look has to do with leaf density. Ginkgo trees do not create densely leaved branches. So, ginkgo bonsai must be grown in a tightly branched style to give the tree an aged look with a dense canopy.

I think that a ginkgo tree grown as a bonsai is going to be a flawed tree. It will never be as refined as an elm tree for example. I will state that I fall into the "Naturalist Camp" and prefer a tree look as much like it full grown counter part as possible minus the proportions. I think that ginkgo bonsai look forced and unnatural. You can grow it into a bonsai but it will always look more like a shrub then a tree.

I have a ginkgo pre-bonsai in training now and am trying to go for a more natural look. call me in 20 years I'll let you know what it looks like, lmao.

Dale Cochoy

Mike,
I wonder how your tree would look in an oval version of this pot?
Dale

Attached Images

	ginkgo.jpg (53.3 KB, 14 views)
	ginkgo2.jpg (48.6 KB, 12 views)
	ginkgo close.jpg (54.8 KB, 8 views)

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Dale Cochoy
Wild Things Bonsai Studio
Yakimono no Kokoro Bonsai Pottery
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EarthgirlOK

That's gorgeous!

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Frogboy

No harm done, michelle. I wasn't mad, just a little disappointed. I know that ginkgo is a touchy subject because of the fierce loyalty ginkgo lovers have. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground, take-it-or-leave-it attitude about ginkgo. It is either love them or hate them. Your answer just brought back bad memories of my high-school teachers getting pissed at me when I told them their answer wasn't good enough, I wanted to know why. Old wounds open easily, I guess. I know how strongly you feel about Ginkgo and I really didn't want to offend anyone by calling them shrubs. Oh, well. Sorry.

I think I have the answers I wanted. It seems that Ginkgo is not really a suitable bonsai specimen. It is used for the same reason many other unsuitable trees are: sentimentality. I can accept that.

I guess i just need to learn to appreciate Ginkgo as a horticultural marvel rather than an artistic.

mike_p

[QUOTE=Frogboy]

I think I have the answers I wanted. It seems that Ginkgo is not really a suitable bonsai specimen. It is used for the same reason many other unsuitable trees are: sentimentality. I can accept that.
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Frogboy, I have to disagree completely with you about the suitability of ginkgo for bonsai. In my 30 years of bonsai, I've seen many fine ginkgo bonsai specimens.

Regards

Mike

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