General questions: JBP Training

007

I bought a 2 year old JBP 'Hayabusa' graft from Brent at EGW's about two seasons ago. I bought it, transplanted it and just let it grow (I have a habit of making sure I can keep something alive before I start messing with it).

Fast forward to today . . . the tree is doing great in my care. It's survived two rather harsh winters here, and has done well in my potting mix. In two seasons it's grown about 5" in height, the trunk has gained about 1/4", and the bark has begun to cork.

It's time that I start thinking about training, shaping, and maintenance. I have a design image in mind . . . I'm going the classic JBP informal upright (uninspired I know, but I feel you've got to tackle the classics first).

I think that my tree is started in the right direction. When I repotted, I planted at a severe angle (pic's to come soon, battery's charging). The SECOND whorl of branches is in a great spot for a first branch, and there are about 5 coming out at this one spot (not including the new leader).

Question 1.) Should I remove any excess branches at this spot and leave only what will be No. 1 branch and new leader?

As of now, the tree is rather "bushy" looking . . . the needles are long. I know that foliage development is one of the last phases of JBP training, but at the same time I do not want to end up with a tree that only has needles at the end of the branch.

Question 2.) Should I be needle plucking/cutting/whatever at this point? How do I do this? (Note: I know this is a debated topic and I do NOT want a debate here, I'm more interested in if I should be doing this now and when).

I've never candle pruned this tree. I understand the purpose and concept behind candle pruning (I've read all the articles on Brent's site and others that have been posted). What I can't seem to find is HOW to do it.

Question 3.) HOW do you remove candles and when? (again, I know that WHEN is another debated issue, I know of the spring and fall pruning, and the differences between strong and weak candling, etc., but are there signs on the tree that will tell me "it's time" or "it's too early" or "it's too late" etc.)

That's all I have for now . . . I've been doing a lot of searching and reading, but the information is so scattered and I can't seem to find the answers I'm looking for.

Thanks,

Justin

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bonsaikc

No need to apologize for what you want to do. Don't accept the phrase "cookie cutter bonsai," just strive to make the best tree you can.

That depends on how big the trunk actually is and what you wish to accomplish. What is the thickness on the trunk? Do you hope to have it much thicker? If you do, it may be too early to cut. If you do cut it, let the new leader grow like crazy to accelerate girth. Your low branches are helpful too, but if they are in a whorl, I'd thin them out so you don't get a big knot.

There may be some disagreement in this area, but I don't think so. IMO, you should remove the excess branches and leave your new leader and at least one branch, perhaps two (to accelerate healing). When you cut the old leader, leave a long stub to dry out. You can carve it later and have a far less noticeable scar. Carving it now will let it bleed and swell.

Needle control is all about balancing energy. If your tree is getting so full that light cannot penetrate to the trunk, I'd start getting rid of old needles. You can get rid of two year old needles at any rate, and the 3 year old ones are dropping anyway. However, if your tree needs to develop, you want it to be strong, so only take the bottom needles and the needles at the upper left and upper right as you look at the branch end-on, as shown in the following post.

http://forum.bonsaitalk.com/229959-post7.html

This will encourage a great deal of bud formation in advantageous spots. Don't worry about needle pulling beyond this for now.

Candle pruning is another energy balancing technique that serves an important second function: done properly, it accelerates ramification and forces good back budding.

Pinching candles in spring has long been advocated as a way to reduce internodes, etc. But if you remove all the candles in summer, the new buds will show up profusely, dividing the strength of the shoot among them, and accomplishing this goal. We were taught for years to time the candle removal by strength of bud (weaker first, then 7-10 days between sections) but this technique is being refined. Total candle removal can be done in one day, combined with selective needle plucking. (This is a refining technique and need not be dealt with here.)

In Kansas, the third week of June is really good for JBP in training. We have a good deal of growing season left, for new buds to develop and set needles. In your area, you may need to do it a little earlier, like the first week in June. You can experiment with the best time to do this in your area. Keep good notes. I should mention that your summer weather can affect your outcome. A very cool rainy summer will not allow your new buds to develop as quickly, and you can have excessively short needles on the tree as a result. A long hot summer encourages more growth of the second flush.

If you follow this method, do not watch the tree for when to remove candles. Watch the calendar. If your candle gets six feet long, just leave it until the time to candle. After candling, when your new buds come out and there are far too many on a shoot, resist the urge to thin them. The more there are, the stronger the shoot was, and the better they divide that energy. Wait until fall to prune the newly opened candles and reduce to two per shoot. This will keep the strong area from pushing those buds too quickly.


There's a lot to absorb and every tree requires something slightly different. It may be that when we see your photos we might say, "don't do anything." So take all this for what it is, a chance to move forward in knowledge of these great trees.

I look forward to your photos.

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Marie1uk

Chris - you should take classes - you're a great teacher. Thanks for the info.

Maz

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007

Here's some pics . . . . sorry for the external link, but it was too many to upload. You can click on the photos for an enlarged pic and a caption.

Web Album: JBP

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CScott

After candling, when your new buds come out and there are far too many on a shoot, resist the urge to thin them. The more there are, the stronger the shoot was, and the better they divide that energy. Wait until fall to prune the newly opened candles and reduce to two per shoot. This will keep the strong area from pushing those buds too quickly.


Thanks for the mini-lesson Chris! I had to refer back to my notes on JBP because I hadn't been waiting until fall to pinch back to two per shoot. I thought you were wrong, because I was doing it as soon as the buds pushed out. But my class notes said exactly what you did . JBP is the perfect specie to practice patience on, and I just found out how impatient I can be. Fall doesn't come to Northern California until mid-November, so candle cutting will be done early July.

Carmen

Brent

Funny, I replied to a similar thread just this week on BonsaiChat:

http://www.bonsaichat.net/showthread.php?t=438

My comments start on page 2.

Brent
EvergreenGardenworks.com
see our blog at http://BonsaiNurseryman.typepad.com

007

Thanks Brent, I read through your posts and I think you said it best that you can read, read, read, and read but until you actually experience it it just doesn't click. That's how I'm feeling . . . I'm just not getting it.

Okay, so I've decided on an overall style for my tree. I've got a good strong tree, and I've got a whorl of branches about an inch above the soil.

This lower branch however that would ultimately be the new leader is weak. How do i strengthen this branch and promote its survival. The candle on this branch is about 1/4" while others on more vigourous branches are an inch plus.

Also, to promote back budding I understand I need to prune, but where? Below a whorl so the whole thing is removed? At the whorl? Just the candles?

?

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Brent

Strengthening a weak low branch on a healthy pine with strong top growth can be a challenge. First, realize that JBP are apically dominant. As long as the top growth remains strong, lower branches will not be stimulated. Additionally, they eventually will be shaded out. That's how pines grow.

If you want to give your pine a temporary boost but still maintain the strong top to develop caliper, you can remove all of the upper terminal buds. The foliage you leave will still keep the plant strong and removal of the terminals will stimulate bud break in the last node, so the break in new growth is only temporary. In addition, position the tree so that the weak branch you want to strengthen is on the south side and remove, or at least head back all the other branches in the same node (except keep one insurance branch, but head it back). Do NOT prune the branch you are trying to strengthen.

This can be done now to take advantage of the spring boost in new growth.

To encourage back budding, there is a series of pruning cuts you can make. First, as explained above, if you remove all the terminals from a branch node, you will encourage budding at the node. This is good for replacing long internodes for shorter ones. You might also get a few breaks farther back (into the next internode). This is really what you want, but it is harder to achieve.

If you still have needles in the last internode, you can get a stronger internodal bud break response if you remove the entire last node. However, this also involves some risk since you don't leave any nodal buds. You may simply lose this last internode. But on a strong plant, and with needles still existing in the internode, you will almost always get a few internodal bud breaks.

The trick to getting a good back budding response to let the pine grow strongly and then hammer it back. If you constantly fuss with your tree, removing all the candles, needle plucking, etc, you won't get the kind of strong growth that you need for a strong response. So, plan ahead and let it grow wild at the areas that you plan to cut back to force back budding. I like to do pruning for back budding in mid summer because the response is quick and strong and there isn't a lot of time for long secondary growth to form, but you can also do it at the end of the season or in winter.

Brent

007

Okay, so I think I at least have a long term goal, and a short term plan (short as in I think I now what to do now . . . in the fall? Good question.)

In order to promote the lower branches, but retain some of the vigor of the lower branches I am going to remove all of the terminal buds (which I assume are the ones in the center of the whorl) on the sacrifice leader.

Secondly, I am going to thin out the branching at each of the lower nodes and retain a single new leader and two potential branches (in case one backfires) . . . everything else will be removed in order to reduce the risk of reverse taper.

Sound like a good short term plan??

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