Gallery Ratings

RonMartin(deceased)

FWIW I am not angry. Gave angry up for Lent last year. It was easiet than giving up the cigarettes )

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John Dixon

A very well-thought out remark sir, my compliments. One problem though, I wait for the DVD!!!

Let me guess, none. I guess that's why I never care about movie critics' opinions. Anybody who can occupy a seat can critique a movie. Bonsai deserves more than that!!!

Like the old football coach said, "Don't complain about the score if you ain't leavin' it all on the field".

Here's a little aside; do you know who Tony Scott is? He is a movie director who has quite a few films to his credit (Top Gun stands out). He is married to a High School classmate of mine, Donna Wilson (a former Miss NC). I met him at our 20th class reunion about this same time last year. Small world, huh?

Warmest regards,

John

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John Dixon

Si vis pacem parabellum

Stay off the trails of others, that's where the booby-traps are.

Attila

Now that's not entirely fair to the critic.

Being a good critic and being a good artist requires an entirely different set of skills. An artist may have very strong convictions and may see things in his own way, unlike anybody else. That's what makes him original, sometimes controversial.

Being a critic, you look at the work from the audience's point of view. You may have to approach it from different angles, depending on who your readers are. You have to be entertaining, thought provoking, and excellent communicator. All those things take a lot of talent, but not the same talent as the artists'. Obviously, they wouldn't do a good job if switching roles. Nobody is good at everything...

Regards,
Attila

P.S.: Critics are also great supporters of the arts. They raise the awareness of the general public and they can draw large audiences with their publications in the media. Any art that wants to be noticed, needs the critic. It's a love-hate relationship.

John Dixon

Attila,

Point taken, but then critics THEMSELVES are not always fair. I've got to be honest about this, critics on ANYTHING, who have not tried to do it themselves, are coming very close to being hypocrites in my book. I work in the law enforcement field (executive branch), but spend most of my time in court (judicial branch). A Judge has to have a background in Law (i.e. practice) before they can take the bench. This is a far cry from the old method of appointing whomever the legislative branch wanted to occupy the seat. That was a very common situation in the early years of the US, and many types of judicial error were the results. Maybe that is a reason why I don't put much faith in the non-practicing critics of bonsai.

One last remark, I wonder how many times a real, bonafide master of bonsai INTENTIONALLY shows a work of no real value just to see if their reputation can sway the critics with a bonsai that has no real merit. Fairness and equality are sometimes the most difficult task to accomplish. Without first-hand knowledge, I think it's nearly impossible. I do not agree that there are two different sets of attributes for artist/critic.

As always, I respect your opinion and thoughts on the matter.

Warmest regards,

John

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John Dixon

Si vis pacem parabellum

Stay off the trails of others, that's where the booby-traps are.

Attila

That's true. And I agree that a critic who has first-hand experience in a specific art may have something that the others don't.

I just don't like to stereotype them into one bunch, there are not all the same. If I did that, I would feel that I am not fair myself. Sometimes I catch myself being prejudiced and judging people without personally knowing them. When that happens, I feel a little ashamed.

Some try their best to be fair and honest, some are hypocrites, with all kinds of agenda.
Just like people, in general.

Best regards,
Attila

Attila

In fact, your point of giving more credit to the critic who has firsthand experience may apply to bonsai more than in any other artform. Someone who knows how hard and time consuming is to work with this medium can certaily be a better critic. One can't just make up a branch here and there, or create a good nebari out of thin air. Someone who tried to do it will have much more insight as to how to judge it.

So, your point may be especially valid when talking about bonsai.

Attila

RonMartin(deceased)

This I really thought needed repeating. Pity not too many critics would follow this sound advise. ;o(

bonsaikc

The thing we have to realize is that the gallery ratings are what they are. Anyone unaware of what makes a quality bonsai will give higher marks to trees that miss that mark but are better than their own. I prefer to look at the trees critically, give a rating, and then explain my rating in the comments.

Just because someone has not made the investment in professional tutelage that I have does not make their opinion not worth hearing. I just weight my response to it according to what I can deduce from their post.

Is it just me, or are all the forums getting far more heated these days? I recently got flamed on another forum for a comment that someone took as pointed at them. It's a shame that we let ourselves get so prickly.

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Sashi-no-eda.blogspot.com

FredL

Well, my goodness, glad I gave this subject a short rest. Do I sense cooler heads prevailing?

Hey, I finally got the message. We like the system the way it is. Having the numbers actually mean something would make it too confusing and might require that judging the Gallery trees would have to be confined to judges that actually know something about Bonsai. And, as has been pointed out by one of our more learned colleagues, to find anybody that meets that standard is virtually impossible.

OK, I'm ready to renounce my heresy and return to the fold as a right-thinking true believer. Thanks for straightening me out, guys. Please count on me for my contribution of 10s for all trees in the future. Since the numbers don't mean anything anyway, it will be pleasant to make people feel good and like me again.

And, Ron, just kidding about those 2s and 4s for your trees. Don't worry, fella, you'll get your 10s, too!

With appropriate best wishea to all, Fred