A brief history of U.S. mallsai?

RedPine

Vance,

The Tennessee thing was a honest mistake,Mississippi is right

But you want to threatan legal action against me because I bought a couple of mallsai from brussels with the visa card..?






And just for the record here..I didnt call anybody anything..or lump a bump...just listed some of the places where I have bought/seen mallsais here in my area and online.Read my post.

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Will_Heath

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Will

jzak

I would take issue with importers who knowingly ship defective trees (i.e. serious wire cuts); who promise delivery of trees held in reserve and prepaid for 3 months only to get the trees that they promised not to send; who send arrangements nowhere ready to ship for a turn in the profit and who after several conversations reply with "what do you expect from a $200 tree?"


the persons involved are both brussel and dana with whom i had several dealings with on a wholesale level (one with refund) and in each case,. their dealings were far less than the honorable presenters of master bonsai teachers (who get paid well enough) that they present. business is afterall, business. i've told dana well enough that they are ripoffs. but some of the things he flogs on ebay are decent, if not pricey.

that's not to say that they don't have nice trees also. just don't trust either one to "hand-pick" one for you. been there, never to return again.

RedPine

Getting back on the Brussels thing for a sec..We have heard the 'support the seller that supports you' qoute.I support Brussels,I have some hardy tools from them,some wire once,pots where what I expected them to be,the trees arrived healthy and still live today.I will gladly order from them again.Don't think I ment any disrespect to their name by my post,just stating a fact.

Also the Bonsaiboy sells mallsais,I haven't bought from them but do notice they sell some more artistic trees aswell.The same with American bonsai nursery,spent a few hundred dollars there aswell,also seen mallsais with some better stuff.Commercial bonsai,mass produced imports or the little glue jobs are all mallsais if you look at the large scale of things,no matter who is selling them.Some of these mallsai we need,they keep the newly intrested and young finding this wonderful art aswell as paying the light bill for most sellers.mm they make good practice material for those of us who get sissor happy to.

The real problem isn't the mallsais I think..it's the uneducated/uncarring people who handle/sell them.Gluing down rocks so soil doesn't spill in shipping,leaving trees boxed up for a month with no water or light.Then unleashing a water hose on them everytime there is a shift change is the usal common practice.

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rockm

"Mallsai" in the U.S. has many different sources, some good, some bad, some plain awful. I've seen "mallsai" junipers and chinese elms churned out by the thousands to be sold at craft shows, etc. The owners of the best bonsai nursery in my area started off in bonsai potting up thousands of "mallsai" junipers that were destined for sale at such events. They were contracted out by another nurseryman who used to import hundreds of specimen-sized chinese elms and thousands of serissa, juinpers and crappy twisty little elms that needed to be potted up in cheap little pots. This doesn't mean he was out to "take" anybody. He was out to make a living. Those plants sold, as did the magnificent 8 inch diameter elms he also imported from China with the money he made on the cheapies. The bigs ones sold for well over $1,000 and were a bargain at that.

Can't begrudge him the sale of the small stuff. That's bread and butter for bonsai sellers. Anyway, the people doing the buying didn't really care that the plant was at best, not a great bonsai, or, at worst, a white elephant they'd never be able to keep alive. They were out to have something unnusual to talk about on their TV set for a few weeks-or until it turned brittle/yellow/olive green, or lost all of its leaves. Maybe one in a thousand of those buyers actually got deeper into bonsai.

The mallsai market is really not the Bonsai market. It's the "Chia Pet" market. That's not really a bad thing, as everyone involved pretty much gets what they're looking for. It may look squalid to people who are into bonsai, but it's really not. It's best not to be too judgemental about mallsai.

Anyway, if you're searching for decent stock, you have to learn the ropes. That takes time and effort--and unfortunately--a little cashola (not alot, if you look in the right places, though). You have to make some mistakes along the way, which means you will basically flush money down the john a couple of times. Eventually, however, you learn where the good trees can be had and who has them.

bneff

One aspect of mallsai that hasn't been brought up is the cut flower analogy. I think a lot of people who buy these trees don't care about getting into bonsai. They want something that's "cool", "pretty", "unique", "oriental" for their dining room table or desk. They'll spend the $30+ the same as a bouquet of cut flowers or a houseplant and consider them the same. When the plant/flowers start dying and/or looking ugly, then they throw them out. They don't want to learn the history of the art or how to prune or repot or even water properly. It's something to be enjoyed for a short period of time.

I've received several pots from people at work who bought a "tree" from a box store or a parking lot vendor and then saved the pot when it died. They just wanted a "flower arrangement".

Bill

Vonsgardens

I would just say, thatt those who have Mallsai- bought them or the beneficiary of a gift from a friend or loved one. If one has buyer's remorse at this time, well, sorry. I just think that unabashed bashing of quality folks is a disservice to all. There are a number of fine "bonsai (and other types of) nurseries" where I have felt that I have not received the appropriate quality and care from. I wouldn't bring it up in this forum beacuse others have had great service from them, I just won't deal with them again myself. Cheers.

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bonsaikc

I'm sorry that your dealings with Brussel and Dana weren't up to your expectations. I have bought trees from Brussel many times in the past and always found him helpful, friendly, courteous, and a true "southern gentleman." If you have problems with trees someone else has picked out for you, of course the obvious remedy is to pick 'em yourself.

Of course it's your right to vote with your pocket book, and to voice your opinion of a company's dealings. But you might do a better job of what you are trying to do by making it less personally hurtful.

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jzak

To set the record straight, I am not out to bash anyone and i've voiced my concerns with Brussel's to all the principal there. My whole intent on this site was to list my experiences (to the tune of several thousand dollars) to show that even some of the so-called best at times aren't and to balance earlier great praises with the reality that i encountered. to persons just tuning in, my point is simply a caveat emptor.


I think MarkM's post is very well taken, as i know the nursery he is refering to -- and it is a very nice one built on 15 years of labor and sweat. trying to make a living at selling bonsai or mallsai is not for the faint of heart (or pocketbook). The search for reputable growers/importers is also not an easy one.

i've sat at many early morning city markets and county fairs, and was intrigued by two events in particular:
1. The great image recognition, even among the youngest of children, that bonsai has. Typical "UUUUUH! Bonsai" and its variant mispronounciations as well as a sincere appreciation for nice trees by people just passing by and admiring. That alone has it's own rewards.
2. The notion that just because its a 'bonsai' that is has to die -- a comment that i've heard literally hundreds of times. i think in part that may result from unscrupulous floggers who sell the boxed, concretized or simply small things that have not had the chance to even root varieties. not failing to mention the sales pitch that junipers are meant to be put on top of t.v. sets near the heater to keep them warm in winter........
3. "Oh, you've got to water these things"

I once had kinko's print a large poster simly stating "HOUSEPLANTS" and featured only shefflera and ficus and the like, denying that they were bonsai. probably my best day for sales ever :-)

john