FredL

Well, it has been interesting, albeit somewhat predictable to read the many replies I have received regarding my musings. Some people had very nice things to say and seemed to understand perfectly what I had to say. Particularly those who sent Private Messages. Others seemed baffled and reverted to making fun of my use of big words and concepts they were unfamiliar with. Others were sarcastic and personal. And a few were outraged, particularly about my irreverrence regarding the sanctity of private property.

It is to this last group that I would like to reply hereby:

You folks make a good point and I can understand how you feel. I, too, have been outraged when people have violated my territory. But, at the same time, there are other aspects to this issue that I find interesting.

Rather like the "Is Bonsai cruel to trees" issue.

I have collected trees on private property as well as public property without permission. I'd be happy to share my experience and the circumstances as well as why I believe it was the right thing to do but I'd rather not subject myself to the (self) righteous anger and indignation of participants who believe any miscreant doing such a thing needs to be subjected to another lecture about what an abominable act it is. As well as what a terrible person (s)he is. I'm not a terrible person and I don't do abominable things It provokes me when I'm told such things and I end up exposing the sand-papery side of my personality when I'm told I am and I do.

Now, this is a subject that I wouldn't mind exploring, but, obviously, BonsaiTalk is not the place to do it. The I people rule the roost on this subject. As on most. The idea that such a subject might have more than one aspect to it is outrageous to them. They feel entitled to lecture others on it and greet any departure from "The Truth" much as Inquisitors dealt with Religious Heretics during the Spanish Inquisition. The idea that an intelligent, thoughtful, generally decent person could defend, much less do such a thing is pretty much beyond their ability to comprehend. Their attitude is pretty much "Think like me or be wrong".

Well, it's hard for me to understand such people or their attitudes, but I'm making the effort to do so. Without condemnation or even judgement. I realize that to expect or even ask them to extend the same effort to me is asking too much. To do so would be in contradiction to their basic nature.

Which brings me back to the dilemma I faced when I left the Forum several months ago: it is simply unrealistic to expect the I folks to tolerate much less encourage people with any point of view other than the most obvious "conventional wisdom", i.e. their point of view. Perhaps their position is based on a sense of having their "personal territory" violated: I can't say as a person who has very little feeling of protection of "my" ideas and a sense of wonder about perceptions different from my own. What I seem to come down to is that the people who sent me Private Messages who otherwise don't participate seem to express the most wisdom in dealing with this issue. BonsaiTalk is simply not a place where I will ever recieve much satisfaction discussing topics in the mode I enjoy. It brings out the worst in me and continually disappoints me. Best to recognize it and move on. It's really not a place for Bonsai enthusiasts, but a place for "experts" to provide advice for "beginners".

As well as a place where folks spend their time either congratulating each other on the correctness of their views or argue over who's right.

Fred